> And don't go saying I should use rust-up. That's a symptom of the very problem I'm describing. What other compiler is only usable if you install from some web

> And don't go saying I should use rust-up. That's a symptom of the very problem I'm describing. What other compiler is only usable if you install from some website instead of your repos? I can't think of any. Lets see... i had this problem with python all the time, the system python version was notoriously old and out of date on macos, redhat, debian, etc. This is how pip and pyenv and a dozen other tools were born. Similar things with node. Or when the distro gcc has a bug that your code hits. Go has this problem too - e.g. the pain around moving from nothing -> dep -> modules was real (if not widely publicized). The language provided version/package manager solves a very real problem. That problem is a mismatch in what a system package should be vs what a development package should be. In some sense containers, nix/guix stye package management, and language specific dependency managers are different approaches to solving the problem: what my computer runs for daily use should be relatively stable and generally I won't need the latest and greatest package features in software I use - upstream developers have generaly dealt with various library deficiencies bugs in their dependencies. In software I develop though, I regularly hit api bugs and sure would like to just use version+1 instead of spending time developing around it. Particularly when the output of my development is a binary that is running in a container on some server.