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Certainly, you can make a case for cities providing broadband just as they provide trash, sewer, parks, libraries, etc. What you can't do is pretend that priva

Certainly, you can make a case for cities providing broadband just as they provide trash, sewer, parks, libraries, etc. What you can't do is pretend that private broadband companies would be competing with municipal broadband on equal footing.

edmundsauto 5y ago
Is it a requirement that these common goods and services have private competition that is on equal footing? Private security, trash services, libraries (netflix) all have private competition that seems to be thriving in the spaces that have higher requirements, but the baseline situation appears to be handled for much of the region.
- winstonewert 5y ago
  It's not a requirement. Or at least: we commonly accept many such services provided by municipalities. What is a requirement is acknowledging the unequal footing.
  - edmundsauto 5y ago
    Public and private will always be on unequal footing, due to the difference in the their objectives. It may also be worthwhile to point out that public infra is designed to serve even people who can’t otherwise afford it, as well as limited by their ability to attract talent. (I’m sure there are others.) I had assumed we all felt comfortable using “public/private” as a shortcut for all of these differences, but am learning that is not necessarily shared. In terms of moving the discussion forward, what were you hoping to achieve by pointing out some of these facts?
    - kgantchev 5y ago
      The difference in footing is not based on objectives but the means by which funding is obtained. In the case of private companies, the funding can only by obtained by providing services that the market demands. The government obtains its funding by taxing people.
    - kortilla 5y ago
      > Public and private will always be on unequal footing, due to the difference in the their objectives. No they won’t. Public projects can be setup to require that they are revenue neutral or positive.
    - winstonewert 5y ago
      I'm hoping to accomplish pointing out the silliness of the post I originally responded to, which asserted that there was no reason to think it would be unfair competition.
iptrans 5y ago
This is a solved problem. The municipality provides the fiber network. All ISPs rent dark fiber, local loops, wavelengths or bitstream access on equal open access terms. All on equal footing and equal terms.

edmundsauto 5y ago

Is it a requirement that these common goods and services have private competition that is on equal footing? Private security, trash services, libraries (netflix) all have private competition that seems to be thriving in the spaces that have higher requirements, but the baseline situation appears to be handled for much of the region.

winstonewert 5y ago
It's not a requirement. Or at least: we commonly accept many such services provided by municipalities. What is a requirement is acknowledging the unequal footing.
- edmundsauto 5y ago
  Public and private will always be on unequal footing, due to the difference in the their objectives. It may also be worthwhile to point out that public infra is designed to serve even people who can’t otherwise afford it, as well as limited by their ability to attract talent. (I’m sure there are others.) I had assumed we all felt comfortable using “public/private” as a shortcut for all of these differences, but am learning that is not necessarily shared. In terms of moving the discussion forward, what were you hoping to achieve by pointing out some of these facts?
  - kgantchev 5y ago
    The difference in footing is not based on objectives but the means by which funding is obtained. In the case of private companies, the funding can only by obtained by providing services that the market demands. The government obtains its funding by taxing people.
  - kortilla 5y ago
    > Public and private will always be on unequal footing, due to the difference in the their objectives. No they won’t. Public projects can be setup to require that they are revenue neutral or positive.
  - winstonewert 5y ago
    I'm hoping to accomplish pointing out the silliness of the post I originally responded to, which asserted that there was no reason to think it would be unfair competition.

iptrans 5y ago

This is a solved problem. The municipality provides the fiber network. All ISPs rent dark fiber, local loops, wavelengths or bitstream access on equal open access terms. All on equal footing and equal terms.