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Chia pre-mined 6 years worth of block rewards. Proof-of-space may be the closest thing we have to a viable proof-of-work replacement but this instantiation of
by greyface- 6y ago
Chia pre-mined 6 years worth of block rewards. Proof-of-space may be the closest thing we have to a viable proof-of-work replacement but this instantiation of it feels like a get rich quick scheme for its founders.
Edit: My calculation was based on the initial reward schedule of 64 units per block, but when you take into account the fact that it ramps down to 4 units per block shortly thereafter, it's actually a premine of 21 years: https://www.coindesk.com/5-takeaways-from-chia-networks-new-white-paper https://www.coindesk.com/5-takeaways-from-chia-networks-new-...
- reasons 6y ago> ... it feels like a get rich quick scheme for its founders Well, Bitcoin itself is a get rich quick scheme for its founders. So are most of its spinoffs.
- eindiran 6y ago> Bitcoin itself is a get rich quick scheme for its founders Regardless of what you think about Bitcoin, this claim is completely ahistorical.
- creato 6y agoSatoshi (or one of his friends) owns 5% of all bitcoins that will ever exist. I wouldn't call it a get rich quick scheme for its founder(s) because I doubt they could have known it would take off the way it did. But, at this point, I don't know that intent matters. Imagine if Bitcoin really did become a dominant currency... one guy would own 5% of it, a deflationary currency! The "fiat billionaires" don't come anywhere close to that kind of concentration of wealth.
- Orochikaku 6y ago'Satoshi' as far as we know is a fiction, it could very well be a psuedonym for an entire team of unknown size
- croon 6y agoDoesn't matter, you can reduce it down to the wallet. (At least) someone has (or at least has at one point had) access to it.
- tnzm 6y agoDoesn't he deserve it? If you were to launch a world-changing project at the cost of disappearing completely, wouldn't you want to reap some benefit from that project if it ever succeeds?
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- dools 6y agoMy hunch is that Bitcoin is actually a project to promulgate Austro-libertarian economics and "Satoshi" is actually a bunch of people hired by stratospherically wealthy libertarians (like the guy that founded Renaissance who is tight with the Mercers). Call me crazy, but after hearing the correlation between people becoming interested in Bitcoin and Austro-libertarianism simultaneously I can't help but think it's a deliberate project.
- tnzm 6y agoThe thing with ideologies (and other kinds of socioeconomical hypotheses) is that they're hyperstitional in nature - you can't prove they're realizable without at the same time deliberately trying to realize them, using people as fodder. (See, communism.) And at least one of the ideologies promulgated in meme-space must have some basis in potential reality (otherwise people wouldn't be at all prone to believing in world-changing ideas). Might be this one, might be not.
- tnzm 6y agoSo are VC unicorns.
- vmception 6y agoLiterally every issued asset in history has a "premine", but somehow last decade's crypto aficionados find this controversial. It's so strange to even care and the market obviously does not care because there is like half a millenium of it never caring. It's nice to see the crypto market maturing and ignoring these people so segregated from every other financial market because they never traded anything else. Low float, "pre-mined" assets are in vogue and represent a more compatible funding model for continued development and personal riches than whatever was happening just a few years ago, let alone through the last decade in crypto. You should ignore the "egalitarian ideology", or completely take advantage of it by launching a Chia-clone without a premine while you simply provide all the storage space first and get the exact same "insta-mine" result while advertising it to people like you that actually care about no premines. A dozen ways to get the same result, its all marketing.
- greyface- 6y ago> simply provide all the storage space first and get the exact same "insta-mine" result while advertising it to people like you that actually care about no premines. A dozen ways to get the same result, its all marketing. You only get the same result if you completely monopolize mining for the first twenty-one years. If you control 50% of mining, it would take 119 years to achieve the equivalent. My issue is not that there is a premine. It's the scale of it.
- vmception 6y agoFair point, founder rewards are pretty common too. Square Inc creates new shares for Jack Dorsey to sell like every week or so. Continual dilution that the market tolerated. Although fairly unique for the equities space, these are the case studies we are growing up with now.
- celticninja 6y agoDo you have a source for that? Doesn't seem like a legit practice on an ongoing basis.
- 6y ago
- freddiecoleman 6y agoRead the business whitepaper to see what they are doing with the pre-farm. https://www.chia.net/2021/02/10/chia-businesss-whitepaper.html https://www.chia.net/2021/02/10/chia-businesss-whitepaper.ht... You are free to agree or disagree with the plan, but need to read it before coming to any conclusions.
- Salgat 6y agoSo the gist of the "strategic reserve" is that they will use pre-mined coins to bolster the company's value and enrich the shareholders.
- celticninja 6y agoOre mine these days just means "we want to get rich off this first, and we don't really want to put any effort or resources into ensuring this. So we are going to allocate ourselves X% of total supply. Satoshi had the decency to mine his coins alongside everyone else.
- rthomas6 6y agoWhat is wrong with proof of stake?
- inter_netuser 6y agoIt’s plutocracy with emojis. Other than that - absolutely nothing
- rthomas6 6y agoI'm not trying to be obtuse, but why is authority tied to amount of coin owned any more plutocratic than authority tied to amount of computing resources used? Both cost money, and both scale power with amount of money sunk into it.
- stirfish 6y agoI don't think it is any more plutocratic. It's about the same.
- meowface 6y agoWhat other options are possible for blockchain networks? All I've seen so far are plutocracy (PoW/PoS blockchains) and oligarchy (centralized blockchains).
- inter_netuser 6y agoPoW is not a plutocracy because miners cannot dictate the protocol rules. Not even a 51% miner could do that, a common misconception. They at most can refuse to process transactions. Users have prevailed agaist miners and large business in Bitcon forkwors, which failed to force their agenda on the users. This is at least some empirical proof in support that Bitcoin is not a plutocracy. Miners have large farms that can be bankrupted by users simply deciding to change the hashing algo. No such option in PoS. In PoS, largest wallets dictate changes. Liquidity begets more liquidity, aka the rich get richer, and such effect has a centralizing effect on PoS. All PoS project to date have failed.
- inter_netuser 6y agoFeel free to fork a version without a premine. The code is licensed under a FOSS license, I believe.