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If I had to wager I'd always bet on the CIA lying, I don't see how anyone could come to another conclusion given their history.
by willcipriano 6y ago
If I had to wager I'd always bet on the CIA lying, I don't see how anyone could come to another conclusion given their history.
- Koshkin 6y agoI've come to a conclusion that, from the evolutionary standpoint, lying (and stealing) is one of the most important forms of the intelligent behavior. We see it in the animal world, so this unavoidably should be seen as such in the world of humans...
- andy_ppp 6y agoHumans have the option of trying to be ethical as well and a lot of people would question if the CIA always behaves ethically.
- ectopod 6y agoSurely no-one believes the CIA always behaves ethically. Especially after the post-9/11 kidnap, torture and murder rampage. Perhaps you meant a lot of people question if the CIA ever behaves ethically.
- andy_ppp 6y agoI’m sure the people that work there think they are a thin line against the harm others would like to do to America. “The ends justify the means”.
- mandmandam 6y agoI would hope they're smarter than that, but apparently not many are.
- kungito 6y agoTrying to take the optimal route in prisoners dilemma would make smart animals stop this behaviour
- chiefalchemist 6y agoIntelligence is as much about focusin and finding as it is about distraction and deception. There's absolutely no morals or ethics at the means level. That's not a judgement. The fact is, the driver is the ends. Meet the objective by (nearly) any means necessary. The CIA, NSA, etc. will - and have - say pretty much anything. That's their job. But why people liken them to some holy higher power is beyond me. Maybe it's a result of the IC's own disinformation? Ironic but fitting.
- scoofy 6y ago>If I had to wager I'd always bet on national security agency of any powerful country lying, I don't see how anyone could come to another conclusion given their history. Let's not pretend the FSB and MSS don't also lie constantly. That you're more familiar with the CIA lying is a testament to the free press of the US, not the other way around. The point of the previous post is that it could easily be another security agency.
- HDMI_Cable 6y agoWouldn't the fact that we know more about the CIA mean that they lie less, since there are verifiable claims to the contrary if they do lie? Like for example how the CIA can't claim it didn't infect Iran with Stuxnet without someone calling BS.
- hulitu 6y agoNo. They dont't lie less. They just try to canalyse the discussion to another subject. Just like ...
- thereare5lights 6y agoHow does it mean they lie less? You don't know everything there is to know about the CIA. All it means that that they can't lie about what you do know.
- _jal 6y ago> Let's not pretend Who is pretending? The discussion is about the CIA. When I discuss cats, there is no reason I should have to always qualify it by saying "yes, and dogs are cute, too."
- oytis 6y agoKaspersky's ties to FSB are an open secret, so it's really believing FSB vs believing CIA unless you have a way to verify them.
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- godelski 6y agoSure, but isn't that true for any intelligence organization? CIA, NSA, FSB, MI5, Mossad, BND, etc?
- willcipriano 6y agoSure, I dont focus on them because I don't believe that Mossad or MI5 are the reason why my country has been at war my entire adult life, but I have witnessed the NSA and CIA justify those wars-that-arent-really-wars time and time again. How much blood was spilled over the 'yellow cake' line alone? Remember when they lost that ten thousand page report on torture right before it was to be delivered? Or the time they dosed unwilling people with LSD or when they smuggled cocaine and fueled the crack epidemic, or when they...
- dataflow 6y agoI'm actually curious precisely what CIA justification you're referring to. What I'm aware of are [1] and [2]. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/03/22/iraq-war-wmds-an-intelligence-failure-or-white-house-spin/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/03/22/iraq-war-... [2] https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/opinions/2003/11/28/myths-about-intelligence/97b131ad-5fc0-4087-99a3-6c3209dede6d/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/opinions/2003/11/28/m...
- willcipriano 6y agohttps://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niger_uranium_forgeries https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niger_uranium_forgeries Folks inside the CIA knew that the yellow cake uranium was a lie and at best, did not make any of this knowledge public as the justification for war was coming together. That silence resulted in the loss of at least one hundred and fifty thousand human beings needlessly and a war that has lasted decades.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
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- anothernewdude 6y agoKaspersky are a branch of Russian intelligence.
- necovek 6y agoSource? Other than Trump, of course.
- ruskimir 6y agoLiterally all China and Russia have to do is get a bot that acts like you and all discourse gets screwed. We're idiots but it's like clockwork and we always fall for it. The IRC is dumbest but most effective organization in the history of state craft.
- dreen 6y agoWell spies are professional liars. I guess it's just as hard for them to not bring their work to home (country) as it is for professional boxers not to keep practicing their job on their spouse.
- specialist 6y ago> If I had to wager I'd always bet on the CIA lying... If an idea is reasonably feasible, I just assume someone, somewhere is already doing it. The practical benefit is lowering my cognitive overhead, transaction costs. Instead of guarding against every possible attack vector, I take basic precautionary measures, and then decide if any action is worth the risk, knowing full well it'll likely go terribly wrong. So I always wear a mask, use a password wallet, drive just under the speed limit. Etc. It's habit, routine. Then when I step outside my personal safety bubble, it's an affirmative choice.