5 ms·

> Musk is nearly a clone of Jobs in affect and attitude and reality distortion effect. Eh, Musk has more negative tendencies than Jobs, especially related to h

by xkjkls 5y ago

> Musk is nearly a clone of Jobs in affect and attitude and reality distortion effect. Eh, Musk has more negative tendencies than Jobs, especially related to his public behavior and honesty. Whatever you might think of Jobs, whenever he issued a firm statement it came true. iPhones were always released on schedule. Musk is years late and many miles short on almost every product he announces. Full Self Driving was supposed to be a thing two years ago. The Tesla Model 3 was supposed to be $35,000 and was also released years late. Tesla Semi? Nonexistent. The Tesla SolarRoof that was the reason for the acquisition of SolarCity never got out of Beta. Jobs also never had the same "$420 funding secured"/"bet you a signed dollar he's a pedophile" behavior Musk has had either. Steve Jobs was definitely a immanently flawed person, but he didn't exhibit the same degree of complete disregard of the consequences of his actions as Musk does, at least not at comparable ages.

vardump 5y ago
Not trying to defend Musk, but his goals are orders of magnitudes harder than what Jobs had to face. Musk is on a mission to Mars and is scared of anything that might delay his ultimate goal.
- xkjkls 5y ago
  Maybe, but we shouldn't defend people's behavior based on their goals. Musk has a massive habit of either stretching the truth, deceiving, outright lying -- whatever you want to call it -- that Jobs didn't. It's a very important distinction. If a kid growing up in technology asked me which one should they try to emulate more, I would say Steve Jobs without a doubt. There are far less moral failings you have to defend within his biography. And two, we should definitely be incredibly skeptical of someone willing to achieve certain goals at all costs. Like ... is going to Mars even a good goal? It's certainly far from obvious that it is. Someone willing to lie, cheat and steal in order to achieve that is not someone I want in my society.
  - vardump 5y ago
    I think Musk will always be a controversial figure. "Musk has a massive habit of either stretching the truth, deceiving, outright lying -- whatever you want to call it -- that Jobs didn't." How do we know it's not his honest belief? That said, I don't think anyone takes (or should take) Musk's promises keeping a straight face when it comes to delivery timelines. I doubt there's anyone who genuinely thinks he is not a major forward pushing force in cleantech and space industry. I believe, in the long run, especially cleantech is likely to be a very important component battling climate change and local pollution. This could very well be about humanity's survival. I'm not saying Musk is somehow single-handedly responsible for this or even that his concrete contribution has been much yet, but what I am saying is that he's showing the industry a way for all this not only to be doable but to also be profitable. And that's the only way I see cleantech going forward — profit. In even longer run we really need to get into space and learn how to live there. Both for not having all of the eggs in the same basket, but also to develop true steady state recycling. Now whether or not Musk delivers on these remains to be seen. At least so far he has been one of the greatest hopes. Not the only one, mind you, but he really has pushed space industry and EV industry forward. That said, I fully agree immoral behavior should not be tolerated. How do we define how much achievement discount we should apply based on other behavior? Should the negative always totally eclipse the positive?
- emptyfile 5y ago
  That fact that people still write this shit with a straight face makes me want to become a hermit and leave this world behind...
  - vardump 5y ago
    Can you elaborate? I'm pretty convinced that's Musk's true motivation. He put his personal fortunes at stake based on this conviction, nearly losing it all. Seems crazy for someone to do that unless it's truly their greatest passion.
wayeq 5y ago
His COVID tweets almost certainly lead to people taking unnecessary risks and dying alone and intubated. Fuck Elon.
- xkjkls 5y ago
  I wouldn't put much blame on him specifically, but yeah, he was enormously irresponsible with a lot of his communication during the pandemic.
- vardump 5y ago
  Hated those tweets. He did seem to realize his mistake, but not to be man enough to actually admit it.
jiofih 5y ago
I’d you’re going to turn this into a competition you need to mention the child that Jobs abandoned?
- xkjkls 5y ago
  Elon Musk is not a stellar husband or father. The stuff described here is as bad as anything Jobs ever did: https://www.marieclaire.com/sex-love/a5380/millionaire-starter-wife/ https://www.marieclaire.com/sex-love/a5380/millionaire-start...

by xkjkls 5y ago

vardump 5y ago

Not trying to defend Musk, but his goals are orders of magnitudes harder than what Jobs had to face. Musk is on a mission to Mars and is scared of anything that might delay his ultimate goal.

xkjkls 5y ago
Maybe, but we shouldn't defend people's behavior based on their goals. Musk has a massive habit of either stretching the truth, deceiving, outright lying -- whatever you want to call it -- that Jobs didn't. It's a very important distinction. If a kid growing up in technology asked me which one should they try to emulate more, I would say Steve Jobs without a doubt. There are far less moral failings you have to defend within his biography. And two, we should definitely be incredibly skeptical of someone willing to achieve certain goals at all costs. Like ... is going to Mars even a good goal? It's certainly far from obvious that it is. Someone willing to lie, cheat and steal in order to achieve that is not someone I want in my society.
- vardump 5y ago
  I think Musk will always be a controversial figure. "Musk has a massive habit of either stretching the truth, deceiving, outright lying -- whatever you want to call it -- that Jobs didn't." How do we know it's not his honest belief? That said, I don't think anyone takes (or should take) Musk's promises keeping a straight face when it comes to delivery timelines. I doubt there's anyone who genuinely thinks he is not a major forward pushing force in cleantech and space industry. I believe, in the long run, especially cleantech is likely to be a very important component battling climate change and local pollution. This could very well be about humanity's survival. I'm not saying Musk is somehow single-handedly responsible for this or even that his concrete contribution has been much yet, but what I am saying is that he's showing the industry a way for all this not only to be doable but to also be profitable. And that's the only way I see cleantech going forward — profit. In even longer run we really need to get into space and learn how to live there. Both for not having all of the eggs in the same basket, but also to develop true steady state recycling. Now whether or not Musk delivers on these remains to be seen. At least so far he has been one of the greatest hopes. Not the only one, mind you, but he really has pushed space industry and EV industry forward. That said, I fully agree immoral behavior should not be tolerated. How do we define how much achievement discount we should apply based on other behavior? Should the negative always totally eclipse the positive?
emptyfile 5y ago
That fact that people still write this shit with a straight face makes me want to become a hermit and leave this world behind...
- vardump 5y ago
  Can you elaborate? I'm pretty convinced that's Musk's true motivation. He put his personal fortunes at stake based on this conviction, nearly losing it all. Seems crazy for someone to do that unless it's truly their greatest passion.

wayeq 5y ago

His COVID tweets almost certainly lead to people taking unnecessary risks and dying alone and intubated. Fuck Elon.

xkjkls 5y ago
I wouldn't put much blame on him specifically, but yeah, he was enormously irresponsible with a lot of his communication during the pandemic.
vardump 5y ago
Hated those tweets. He did seem to realize his mistake, but not to be man enough to actually admit it.

jiofih 5y ago

I’d you’re going to turn this into a competition you need to mention the child that Jobs abandoned?

xkjkls 5y ago
Elon Musk is not a stellar husband or father. The stuff described here is as bad as anything Jobs ever did: https://www.marieclaire.com/sex-love/a5380/millionaire-starter-wife/ https://www.marieclaire.com/sex-love/a5380/millionaire-start...