4 ms·

I often wonder is their is a Phoebus equivalent in the SmartPhone market. I am unsure how we got to a point where the life span of a $900-$1,200 device is meas

by syshum 6y ago

I often wonder is their is a Phoebus equivalent in the SmartPhone market. I am unsure how we got to a point where the life span of a $900-$1,200 device is measured in months not years is acceptable but is seems to me it would have to involve some conspiracy especially when the technology they replaced or augmented (traditional phones and laptops) where all measured in years, multiple years.

kalleboo 6y ago
My mother-in-law is still using my hand-me-down iPhone 6s, a 6 year old phone that still runs the latest iOS.
shadowgovt 6y ago
It is entirely possible, but in the case of smartphones the hardware processes and systems are so new that we're also seeing the effects of "crapshoot integration..." The market is moving so fast that there isn't time to run enough tests to have strong expectations on the ten-year lifespan of the product. Batteries, in particular, are such bleeding-edge technology (and in a space of chemistry so poorly theoretically understood) that every new design is more or less a dice-roll on the long-term performance. The hallmark of a Phoebus-cartel-style situation would be if smartphones from N years ago from multiple manufacturers were still going strong but newer phones were slower, or had crappier battery life, or broke down more often (consistently year-over-year). I'm not sure that's an easy comparison to make; go too far back in the space and you pass into the pre-iPhone, pre-Android era "smartphones" that were robust as hell but remarkably featureless relative to what came after. That having been said, Apple has been sued over the planned obsolescence of its smartphones (https://www.macrumors.com/2021/04/08/apple-chile-planned-obsolescence-lawsuit https://www.macrumors.com/2021/04/08/apple-chile-planned-obs...)
- interestica 6y ago
  > that every new design is more or less a dice-roll on the long-term performance. Sometimes things happen to make companies uh take note: https://www.wired.com/2017/01/why-the-samsung-galaxy-note-7-kept-exploding/ https://www.wired.com/2017/01/why-the-samsung-galaxy-note-7-...
bserge 6y ago
If there is, it's a pretty bad cartel seeing as the older devices do not actually break after a year or so :)
- benjaminjosephw 6y ago
  If new devices are more likely to break than old ones doesn't that suggest that planned obsolescence has been introduced? Probably not because of a cartel but almost certainly due to plain old greed and a lack of moral integrity.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
intergalplan 6y ago
> I am unsure how we got to a point where the life span of a $900-$1,200 device is measured in months not years Because we didn't get to that point? My Apple phones last 3+ years unless I break them, and only the ones I hold on to for closer to 5 years aren't still working entirely fine when I upgrade; usually all they'd need to keep working for another couple years is a battery replacement.
michaelmrose 6y ago
You either had bad luck, are doing something to break them, or purchased particularly bad phones. Phones last years now although first party software updates are frequently only available for 1-2 years and apps eventually are made that require more recent android versions effectively forcing you to update in 5 years to have access to all possible apps. Games may be more aggressive in their requirements as well.
- syshum 6y ago
  >> first party software updates are frequently only available for 1-2 year Bingo, that is the planned obsolesce part. too many people here are focusing on physical viability, not software viability. From a security standpoint, if it is out of support it is a brick, and the number of vulnerabilities that are discovered on these devices NO ONE should be running a mobile computer with current updates So sure the device may physically still turn on, and you can still "use" it, it is not something I would recommend.
  - michaelmrose 6y ago
    This isn't how people actually use phones. People upgrade more frequently because they want new phones. The percentage that is considering the security of their device is a single digit percentage.
- walshemj 6y ago
  I have only just replaced my Moto 4g 2014 (£170) with a motog9 power - the battery just would not hold a useful charge.
  - michaelmrose 6y ago
    I have the 7 which I got for almost nothing. FANTASTIC battery but its going to be interesting to replace someday.
gsich 6y ago
With Android certainly. I wouldn't expect any Android phone today to still receive updates in 5 years.

by syshum 6y ago

kalleboo 6y ago

My mother-in-law is still using my hand-me-down iPhone 6s, a 6 year old phone that still runs the latest iOS.

shadowgovt 6y ago

It is entirely possible, but in the case of smartphones the hardware processes and systems are so new that we're also seeing the effects of "crapshoot integration..." The market is moving so fast that there isn't time to run enough tests to have strong expectations on the ten-year lifespan of the product. Batteries, in particular, are such bleeding-edge technology (and in a space of chemistry so poorly theoretically understood) that every new design is more or less a dice-roll on the long-term performance. The hallmark of a Phoebus-cartel-style situation would be if smartphones from N years ago from multiple manufacturers were still going strong but newer phones were slower, or had crappier battery life, or broke down more often (consistently year-over-year). I'm not sure that's an easy comparison to make; go too far back in the space and you pass into the pre-iPhone, pre-Android era "smartphones" that were robust as hell but remarkably featureless relative to what came after. That having been said, Apple has been sued over the planned obsolescence of its smartphones (https://www.macrumors.com/2021/04/08/apple-chile-planned-obsolescence-lawsuit https://www.macrumors.com/2021/04/08/apple-chile-planned-obs...)

interestica 6y ago
> that every new design is more or less a dice-roll on the long-term performance. Sometimes things happen to make companies uh take note: https://www.wired.com/2017/01/why-the-samsung-galaxy-note-7-kept-exploding/ https://www.wired.com/2017/01/why-the-samsung-galaxy-note-7-...

bserge 6y ago

If there is, it's a pretty bad cartel seeing as the older devices do not actually break after a year or so :)

benjaminjosephw 6y ago
If new devices are more likely to break than old ones doesn't that suggest that planned obsolescence has been introduced? Probably not because of a cartel but almost certainly due to plain old greed and a lack of moral integrity.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

intergalplan 6y ago

> I am unsure how we got to a point where the life span of a $900-$1,200 device is measured in months not years Because we didn't get to that point? My Apple phones last 3+ years unless I break them, and only the ones I hold on to for closer to 5 years aren't still working entirely fine when I upgrade; usually all they'd need to keep working for another couple years is a battery replacement.

michaelmrose 6y ago

You either had bad luck, are doing something to break them, or purchased particularly bad phones. Phones last years now although first party software updates are frequently only available for 1-2 years and apps eventually are made that require more recent android versions effectively forcing you to update in 5 years to have access to all possible apps. Games may be more aggressive in their requirements as well.

syshum 6y ago
>> first party software updates are frequently only available for 1-2 year Bingo, that is the planned obsolesce part. too many people here are focusing on physical viability, not software viability. From a security standpoint, if it is out of support it is a brick, and the number of vulnerabilities that are discovered on these devices NO ONE should be running a mobile computer with current updates So sure the device may physically still turn on, and you can still "use" it, it is not something I would recommend.
- michaelmrose 6y ago
  This isn't how people actually use phones. People upgrade more frequently because they want new phones. The percentage that is considering the security of their device is a single digit percentage.
walshemj 6y ago
I have only just replaced my Moto 4g 2014 (£170) with a motog9 power - the battery just would not hold a useful charge.
- michaelmrose 6y ago
  I have the 7 which I got for almost nothing. FANTASTIC battery but its going to be interesting to replace someday.

gsich 6y ago

With Android certainly. I wouldn't expect any Android phone today to still receive updates in 5 years.