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> For my part, I held <$10,000 USD worth of Bitcoin prior to 2016, plus small amounts of altcoins. LOL ouch. Selling prior to 2016 must sting. It makes sense t

> For my part, I held <$10,000 USD worth of Bitcoin prior to 2016, plus small amounts of altcoins. LOL ouch. Selling prior to 2016 must sting. It makes sense that somebody who made this mistake would be bitter. This guys take of: > It has failed to be a useful currency, invented a new class of internet abuse, further enriched the rich, wasted staggering amounts of electricity, hastened climate change, ruined hundreds of otherwise promising projects, provided a climate for hundreds of scams to flourish, created shortages and price hikes for consumer hardware, and injected perverse incentives into technology everywhere. is so bad and off the mark and missing the reality that is it even worth a well-thought reply? This reminds me of people who would shit on the Internet in the 90's because of porn and scams and this and that. The Internet had and will always have negative components but it's worth fighting for because of all the good. Crypto and decentralization is exactly the same way and in many ways even more important.

shkkmo 5y ago
Seems completely on the mark to me. Your dismissals don't seem appropriate to HN. Please name one good thing crypto helps people accomplish that doesn't involve breaking the law (or speculation.)
- eric_cc 5y ago
  off the top of my head: DeFi, NFT's, data storage, services for the bankless, decentralized metaverses, insurance, synthetics, music streaming, video streaming, social networks, DAO's, social money
  - shkkmo 5y ago
    I think most, if not all, of those things work fine (and arguably better) without using a cryptocurrency.
    - eric_cc 5y ago
      so you see no value to: - DeFi - decentralized data storage. - a decentralized & censorship resistant video streaming platform. - Artists getting compensated fairly via NFT's. - Banking the bankless - DAO's (btw, how can DAO's work better without being decentralized? hahaha) - A decentralized and censorship resistant social network - Sythentics. What is a better solution to tokenizing assets in your opinion? and on and on..
      - shkkmo 5y ago
        I see plenty of value in many of those issues. Some appear to be just jargon or beg the question. I see zero evidence that cryptocurrency is necessary or even beneficial in solving any of those problems.
        doggosphere 5y ago
        That's because you think your currency is secure forever. Ask Argentinians, Turks, Venezuelans, Zimbabweans, etc. what they think about their central banks.
        shkkmo 5y ago
        I don't think my, or any, national currency is secure forever, but neither is any cryptocurrency. Currently national currencies are, on average, far more stable and secure places to hold assets than any cryptocurrency. If your national isn't as stable as you like, you can more easily use a different national currency. If your country has capital controls that prohibit this, then you are using cryptocurrency to break the law. My contention is that so far the only use cases cryptocurrency has been successful in are illegal. If the legal restrictions in those areas were removed, cryptocurrency would no longer be useful there.
        doggosphere 5y ago
        Currently national currencies are, on average, far more stable and secure places to hold assets than any cryptocurrency. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/M2SL https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/M2SL Did you expect 20% of all US dollars would have been created in 2020? 4x in the last 20 years. That doesn't sound stable to me. When your currency can be debased by 20% in a year, with no democratic process or recourse; 6 board members appointed by Presidents, serving 14 year terms, decide what the price of money is, and how much of it exists. Alternatively Bitcoin's supply schedule is transparent, auditable, open source, mathematically provable. If your national isn't as stable as you like, you can more easily use a different national currency. If your country has capital controls that prohibit this, then you are using cryptocurrency to break the law. And what happens when the ultimate reserve currency (USD) is broken? People flee to gold. Well, Bitcoin is digital gold; its more secure, cheaper to carry, has better supply stability. Your solution to escaping a sinking ship is essentially jumping into a more slowly sinking ship. My contention is that so far the only use cases cryptocurrency has been successful in are illegal. If the legal restrictions in those areas were removed, cryptocurrency would no longer be useful there. The use case for cryptocurrency is escaping government monopoly of money, returning a savings rate to individuals and institutions.
tome 5y ago
> Selling prior to 2016 must sting. It makes sense that somebody who made this mistake would be bitter. Selling bitcoin prior to any time must sting (and in fact that's a very strong argument against bitcoin as a currency). This argument holds no water.
NoGravitas 5y ago
> This reminds me of people who would shit on the Internet in the 90's because of porn and scams and this and that. In retrospect, those people were ahead of their time.

shkkmo 5y ago

Seems completely on the mark to me. Your dismissals don't seem appropriate to HN. Please name one good thing crypto helps people accomplish that doesn't involve breaking the law (or speculation.)

eric_cc 5y ago
off the top of my head: DeFi, NFT's, data storage, services for the bankless, decentralized metaverses, insurance, synthetics, music streaming, video streaming, social networks, DAO's, social money
- shkkmo 5y ago
  I think most, if not all, of those things work fine (and arguably better) without using a cryptocurrency.
  - eric_cc 5y ago
    so you see no value to: - DeFi - decentralized data storage. - a decentralized & censorship resistant video streaming platform. - Artists getting compensated fairly via NFT's. - Banking the bankless - DAO's (btw, how can DAO's work better without being decentralized? hahaha) - A decentralized and censorship resistant social network - Sythentics. What is a better solution to tokenizing assets in your opinion? and on and on..
    - shkkmo 5y ago
      I see plenty of value in many of those issues. Some appear to be just jargon or beg the question. I see zero evidence that cryptocurrency is necessary or even beneficial in solving any of those problems.
      - doggosphere 5y ago
        That's because you think your currency is secure forever. Ask Argentinians, Turks, Venezuelans, Zimbabweans, etc. what they think about their central banks.
        shkkmo 5y ago
        I don't think my, or any, national currency is secure forever, but neither is any cryptocurrency. Currently national currencies are, on average, far more stable and secure places to hold assets than any cryptocurrency. If your national isn't as stable as you like, you can more easily use a different national currency. If your country has capital controls that prohibit this, then you are using cryptocurrency to break the law. My contention is that so far the only use cases cryptocurrency has been successful in are illegal. If the legal restrictions in those areas were removed, cryptocurrency would no longer be useful there.
        doggosphere 5y ago
        Currently national currencies are, on average, far more stable and secure places to hold assets than any cryptocurrency. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/M2SL https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/M2SL Did you expect 20% of all US dollars would have been created in 2020? 4x in the last 20 years. That doesn't sound stable to me. When your currency can be debased by 20% in a year, with no democratic process or recourse; 6 board members appointed by Presidents, serving 14 year terms, decide what the price of money is, and how much of it exists. Alternatively Bitcoin's supply schedule is transparent, auditable, open source, mathematically provable. If your national isn't as stable as you like, you can more easily use a different national currency. If your country has capital controls that prohibit this, then you are using cryptocurrency to break the law. And what happens when the ultimate reserve currency (USD) is broken? People flee to gold. Well, Bitcoin is digital gold; its more secure, cheaper to carry, has better supply stability. Your solution to escaping a sinking ship is essentially jumping into a more slowly sinking ship. My contention is that so far the only use cases cryptocurrency has been successful in are illegal. If the legal restrictions in those areas were removed, cryptocurrency would no longer be useful there. The use case for cryptocurrency is escaping government monopoly of money, returning a savings rate to individuals and institutions.

tome 5y ago

> Selling prior to 2016 must sting. It makes sense that somebody who made this mistake would be bitter. Selling bitcoin prior to any time must sting (and in fact that's a very strong argument against bitcoin as a currency). This argument holds no water.

NoGravitas 5y ago

> This reminds me of people who would shit on the Internet in the 90's because of porn and scams and this and that. In retrospect, those people were ahead of their time.