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> we'll have a test case soon. It already exists and is called Austria. The effect is that every job advertisement since 2011 says: "The minimum salary amount

by bmn__ 6y ago

> we'll have a test case soon. It already exists and is called Austria. The effect is that every job advertisement since 2011 says: "The minimum salary amounts to xxxx € according to law/ordinance/collective labour agreement. According to candidate's skill set a recompense higher than that is possible." The first sentence is mandatory. The second is not, but has become a stable trope. Question for HN readers: do you think this is useful? Why/why not?

tharkun__ 6y ago
The second sentence actually even goes more like 'We will pay higher than that based on experience". As in they know that the collective bargaining agreement minimums will not get them anyone and they know this and will obviously pay more. Please apply! ;) The system is basically an automatically fully unionized labour market. I think it's valuable. Very much so actually. Not necessarily for software engineering jobs at the moment, because companies will have to pay above that to get someone anyway. In general though I think this helps people be paid more fairly overall. It might not result SV salaries anytime soon. I'd say it helps newcomers to the job market a lot (both career start wise as well as moving to Austria from somewhere else. Again don't just think SWE here. This kind of system also goes with other social stability benefits that might be strange to North Americans. Overall it should result in better care for everyone (health care, pensions etc) while it also equalizes the top towards the bottom more. Germany isn't Austria but close. I know there for example, state pension and health care were top notch. You didn't have to have a 401k or an RRSP or an expensive extra health insurance/a good employer. The state took care of it (you paid higher taxes overall though). Then the system broke and they told people in their 50s: oh btw the pension system is broken and broke. You have to start saving up for yourself. Oh and we will also tax your pensions now! (which they didn't before). Oh and btw this and this and this will no longer be covered by your health insurance. You better get extra insurance. Screwed a good many people over that believed they were taken care of. Never mind the people that just can't start saving for themselves or buy the extra insurance. But there's also no 401k/RRSP system. The "Riester Rente" and the current 401k/RRSP "equivalent" basically just funnels your money into insurance companies. No way to invest yourself while being tax sheltered.
Balgair 6y ago
Well, it's been 10 years now. What has happened as compared to before?

by bmn__ 6y ago

tharkun__ 6y ago

The second sentence actually even goes more like 'We will pay higher than that based on experience". As in they know that the collective bargaining agreement minimums will not get them anyone and they know this and will obviously pay more. Please apply! ;) The system is basically an automatically fully unionized labour market. I think it's valuable. Very much so actually. Not necessarily for software engineering jobs at the moment, because companies will have to pay above that to get someone anyway. In general though I think this helps people be paid more fairly overall. It might not result SV salaries anytime soon. I'd say it helps newcomers to the job market a lot (both career start wise as well as moving to Austria from somewhere else. Again don't just think SWE here. This kind of system also goes with other social stability benefits that might be strange to North Americans. Overall it should result in better care for everyone (health care, pensions etc) while it also equalizes the top towards the bottom more. Germany isn't Austria but close. I know there for example, state pension and health care were top notch. You didn't have to have a 401k or an RRSP or an expensive extra health insurance/a good employer. The state took care of it (you paid higher taxes overall though). Then the system broke and they told people in their 50s: oh btw the pension system is broken and broke. You have to start saving up for yourself. Oh and we will also tax your pensions now! (which they didn't before). Oh and btw this and this and this will no longer be covered by your health insurance. You better get extra insurance. Screwed a good many people over that believed they were taken care of. Never mind the people that just can't start saving for themselves or buy the extra insurance. But there's also no 401k/RRSP system. The "Riester Rente" and the current 401k/RRSP "equivalent" basically just funnels your money into insurance companies. No way to invest yourself while being tax sheltered.

Balgair 6y ago

Well, it's been 10 years now. What has happened as compared to before?