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All good points! I agree precisely, and have long said that a critical attribute of any volunteer-based group is having a culture that facilitates renewal of th

All good points! I agree precisely, and have long said that a critical attribute of any volunteer-based group is having a culture that facilitates renewal of the volunteer corps, so the inevitable turnover doesn't equate to degradation. Once you have that, you can _encourage_ turnover to avert burnout, even. That's magical when it works. The for-profits around here have all gone out of business. TechShop's business model was predicated on people paying for a nearly-endless stream of basic classes for the privilege of using equipment they were already ostensibly paying for access to as part of their membership. I understand this to some degree (broken tools suck, and training helps them break a little bit less), but they extended it even to things you couldn't break if you tried ($79/$99 for the vinyl cutter SBU?!?), and I think people were rightly turned off by that. I'm sad that they're gone (it was nice to be able to send people there when they needed more hand-holding than we're able to provide), but I'm hardly surprised. Non-profits can pay staff, by the way, they just can't have investors making dividends and stuff. But yeah, we're the kind of volunteer-driven space you imagine.

Animats 6y ago
TechShop's business model... TechShop's business model was predicated on more investors coming in to fund growth, while the actual operations lost money. This didn't become clear until the financials came out during the bankruptcy lawsuits.[1] The operating problem was that the "gym model" didn't work. Gyms thrive on members who pay but don't show up too much. Flat-rate maker spaces get customers for whom it's their primary workplace, tying up the equipment all day. This reached its extreme during the Etsy period, when TechShop had 10 laser cutters making stuff all day. [1] https://blog.adafruit.com/2020/01/31/latest-bankruptcy-court-filings-for-techshop-inc-1-29-2020-techshop/ https://blog.adafruit.com/2020/01/31/latest-bankruptcy-court...
- bsder 6y ago
  > This reached its extreme during the Etsy period, when TechShop had 10 laser cutters making stuff all day. To be fair, anybody who has run one of these spaces knows that the lasers and the wood CNC are going to be 100% utilized. You have to set your fees and limits around that. TechShop was fine as a shop it just always seemed to be somewhat questionable in terms of business. The placement of their shops was a good example. TechShop always seemed to be in kinda expensive real estate while all the decent makerspaces I know are always in some kind of slightly grotty industrial park area.
bsder 6y ago
> I understand this to some degree (broken tools suck, and training helps them break a little bit less) True. But my assumption about "training classes" at makerspaces is that they are primarily about liability insurance and secondarily about training. If you have been through the training and it's signed off, the space can say "Look. You went through training where we told you the risks--it's right here on page 2. Sorry that you're injured, but it's not our problem." If you haven't been through training then they can say: "You weren't authorized for that machine and used it anyway so we aren't liable."

Animats 6y ago

TechShop's business model... TechShop's business model was predicated on more investors coming in to fund growth, while the actual operations lost money. This didn't become clear until the financials came out during the bankruptcy lawsuits.[1] The operating problem was that the "gym model" didn't work. Gyms thrive on members who pay but don't show up too much. Flat-rate maker spaces get customers for whom it's their primary workplace, tying up the equipment all day. This reached its extreme during the Etsy period, when TechShop had 10 laser cutters making stuff all day. [1] https://blog.adafruit.com/2020/01/31/latest-bankruptcy-court-filings-for-techshop-inc-1-29-2020-techshop/ https://blog.adafruit.com/2020/01/31/latest-bankruptcy-court...

bsder 6y ago
> This reached its extreme during the Etsy period, when TechShop had 10 laser cutters making stuff all day. To be fair, anybody who has run one of these spaces knows that the lasers and the wood CNC are going to be 100% utilized. You have to set your fees and limits around that. TechShop was fine as a shop it just always seemed to be somewhat questionable in terms of business. The placement of their shops was a good example. TechShop always seemed to be in kinda expensive real estate while all the decent makerspaces I know are always in some kind of slightly grotty industrial park area.

bsder 6y ago

> I understand this to some degree (broken tools suck, and training helps them break a little bit less) True. But my assumption about "training classes" at makerspaces is that they are primarily about liability insurance and secondarily about training. If you have been through the training and it's signed off, the space can say "Look. You went through training where we told you the risks--it's right here on page 2. Sorry that you're injured, but it's not our problem." If you haven't been through training then they can say: "You weren't authorized for that machine and used it anyway so we aren't liable."