6 ms·

In Britain, the rich are richer but the poor far poorer than in Europe

49 points by rustoo 6y ago

LatteLazy 6y ago
Only 50 years ago the UK was to the left of Europe politically and joining was seen as a way to lock in right win ideas like free markets. Now we are quite far to the right of them.
- Dma54rhs 6y ago
  Well at least Corbyn got his life long dream of getting out of EU. He was pushing the idea for what, 20 years?
  - LatteLazy 6y ago
    Yeah, I'm just not sure post brexit Britian will be the socialist people republic he expected...
samsquire 6y ago
House prices in the UK are ridiculous. The average house price outside of London is £245,128 [1] If I were to guess it's closer to £250k now. Rent is expensive too. Our economy is a service based on economy but I don't see where all the good jobs are. They're in London. Not distributed across the UK. I think people are getting poorer too. Wage inflation is non-existent. [1] https://www.gov.uk/government/news/uk-house-price-index-for-april-2019 https://www.gov.uk/government/news/uk-house-price-index-for-...
- libertine 6y ago
  Eh, same is happening in Portugal. In fact now some people are starting to buy their second home in the country side, Lisbon is already fucked and now it's going on in the interior of the country. Let's not forget that the EU has a long tail, a some countries are at the tip of it with cheap real state for some countries standards.
  - djbebs 6y ago
    The problem in portugal is purely a political and regulatory one. On a 200k€ house you're paying roughly 50k€ on top for taxes and fees alone.
    - libertine 6y ago
      I disagree, specially if you're looking at what you can get for 200k€.
      - tartoran 6y ago
        > I disagree, specially if you're looking at what you can get for 200k€. Is it better or worse than in the UK? I know some folks who moved to Portugal to retire and they bought an amazing large house for 150k euros about 5 years ago. It wasn’t in Lisbon but Albufeira and that location works out for their age group. I think their property appreciated quite a bit since then and overall they are much much happier than they were in New York.
        libertine 6y ago
        I think in the end it's worse for the simple fact that our income is way lower than the ones in the UK. Like, maybe the avg middle class family in the UK can easily buy a house in Portugal bellow the market value of the UK, while the avg portuguese middle class family can't do that in Portugal, let alone the buying an house in the UK lol. This is one of those things the fuel the extremes in politics - a lot of people that I know are starting to become outraged that we can't afford houses in our own country. It's like our solution is to start to look for house in the north of Africa (it's a bad and sad joke), or to go to other EU country (or the UK), work there for a decade +, and return to buy an house in Portugal. If nothing is done, and a lot of people keep parking money in Portugal housing market (some as imigrants, like your friends or others from UK/richer European countries, or people just buying golden visas through realstate to get a EU passports), then I'm afraid nothing good will come out of this. A lot of people thought it was the migrant crisis that might start the fire for the for extreme-right in Portugal, I think the end will be hyper inflation and the housing market - all because people just want to live in dignity where they were born, and they're being squeezed out.
- Proven 6y ago
  It's the same everywhere. Thank central banks.
- domano 6y ago
  Wow Germany is much more expensive then. And i am looking at prices near my mid-sized town, not berlin or munich or anything. Would love to get a house for that price. In that price range i would be looking at a flat for 2 people, not a house.
  - gigabuddha 6y ago
    Don't forget UK includes the sparsely populated Wales, Scotland, and Northern Ireland. The average house price near a mid-sized town in England would be more.
  - xnyan 6y ago
    For various reasons, Germans have taken a different approach to housing vs the US and most of Europe. Home ownership is in the mid 40% range, vs 65%+ for the UK and US. Housing there is seen more as a cost than as an investment, with most people renting and the building itself generally owned entities like pension funds.
- Cypher 6y ago
  The NHS nurses got +1% payrise for their efforts mean while m2 money supply is 50% than 2016 crazy times
quattrofan 6y ago
We can thank the Tories being in power now for almost 11years.
aaaxyz 6y ago
For reference, the poorest quintile in the US earns 35k and the richest 230k (and the gap is widening), according to https://www.cbo.gov/publication/56575 https://www.cbo.gov/publication/56575
- panny 6y ago
  >For reference, the poorest quintile in the US earns 35k Which interestingly, is enough to make them part of the 1% https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2082385/We-1--You-need-34k-income-global-elite--half-worlds-richest-live-U-S.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2082385/We-1--You-n...
panny 6y ago
I don't really find this surprising at all. Isn't this why Brexit happened? Britain was flooded with poor from all over Europe looking a piece of the wealth for which Britain is famous. It's not surprising then that there is great divide between the richest and poorest. It seems like the article implies that now that poor immigrants have been allowed into Britain, the people who built the wealthy society are now obligated to hand over all the wealth created to the new comers who didn't have anything to do with the creation of said wealth.
wolfretcrap 6y ago
Poors are screwed doesn't matter if it's EU, UK or US or even Africa. Only the magnitude of screwed differs. I've come up with an idea that we should do a swap, where a rich person is allowed to be rich for 2 years then a poor person takes his place. So the richest person swaps his place with the poorest one and vice versa.

49 points by rustoo 6y ago

Only 50 years ago the UK was to the left of Europe politically and joining was seen as a way to lock in right win ideas like free markets. Now we are quite far to the right of them.

Dma54rhs 6y ago
Well at least Corbyn got his life long dream of getting out of EU. He was pushing the idea for what, 20 years?
- LatteLazy 6y ago
  Yeah, I'm just not sure post brexit Britian will be the socialist people republic he expected...

samsquire 6y ago

House prices in the UK are ridiculous. The average house price outside of London is £245,128 [1] If I were to guess it's closer to £250k now. Rent is expensive too. Our economy is a service based on economy but I don't see where all the good jobs are. They're in London. Not distributed across the UK. I think people are getting poorer too. Wage inflation is non-existent. [1] https://www.gov.uk/government/news/uk-house-price-index-for-april-2019 https://www.gov.uk/government/news/uk-house-price-index-for-...

libertine 6y ago
Eh, same is happening in Portugal. In fact now some people are starting to buy their second home in the country side, Lisbon is already fucked and now it's going on in the interior of the country. Let's not forget that the EU has a long tail, a some countries are at the tip of it with cheap real state for some countries standards.
- djbebs 6y ago
  The problem in portugal is purely a political and regulatory one. On a 200k€ house you're paying roughly 50k€ on top for taxes and fees alone.
  - libertine 6y ago
    I disagree, specially if you're looking at what you can get for 200k€.
    - tartoran 6y ago
      > I disagree, specially if you're looking at what you can get for 200k€. Is it better or worse than in the UK? I know some folks who moved to Portugal to retire and they bought an amazing large house for 150k euros about 5 years ago. It wasn’t in Lisbon but Albufeira and that location works out for their age group. I think their property appreciated quite a bit since then and overall they are much much happier than they were in New York.
      - libertine 6y ago
        I think in the end it's worse for the simple fact that our income is way lower than the ones in the UK. Like, maybe the avg middle class family in the UK can easily buy a house in Portugal bellow the market value of the UK, while the avg portuguese middle class family can't do that in Portugal, let alone the buying an house in the UK lol. This is one of those things the fuel the extremes in politics - a lot of people that I know are starting to become outraged that we can't afford houses in our own country. It's like our solution is to start to look for house in the north of Africa (it's a bad and sad joke), or to go to other EU country (or the UK), work there for a decade +, and return to buy an house in Portugal. If nothing is done, and a lot of people keep parking money in Portugal housing market (some as imigrants, like your friends or others from UK/richer European countries, or people just buying golden visas through realstate to get a EU passports), then I'm afraid nothing good will come out of this. A lot of people thought it was the migrant crisis that might start the fire for the for extreme-right in Portugal, I think the end will be hyper inflation and the housing market - all because people just want to live in dignity where they were born, and they're being squeezed out.
Proven 6y ago
It's the same everywhere. Thank central banks.
domano 6y ago
Wow Germany is much more expensive then. And i am looking at prices near my mid-sized town, not berlin or munich or anything. Would love to get a house for that price. In that price range i would be looking at a flat for 2 people, not a house.
- gigabuddha 6y ago
  Don't forget UK includes the sparsely populated Wales, Scotland, and Northern Ireland. The average house price near a mid-sized town in England would be more.
- xnyan 6y ago
  For various reasons, Germans have taken a different approach to housing vs the US and most of Europe. Home ownership is in the mid 40% range, vs 65%+ for the UK and US. Housing there is seen more as a cost than as an investment, with most people renting and the building itself generally owned entities like pension funds.
Cypher 6y ago
The NHS nurses got +1% payrise for their efforts mean while m2 money supply is 50% than 2016 crazy times

quattrofan 6y ago

We can thank the Tories being in power now for almost 11years.

aaaxyz 6y ago

For reference, the poorest quintile in the US earns 35k and the richest 230k (and the gap is widening), according to https://www.cbo.gov/publication/56575 https://www.cbo.gov/publication/56575

panny 6y ago
>For reference, the poorest quintile in the US earns 35k Which interestingly, is enough to make them part of the 1% https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2082385/We-1--You-need-34k-income-global-elite--half-worlds-richest-live-U-S.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2082385/We-1--You-n...

panny 6y ago

I don't really find this surprising at all. Isn't this why Brexit happened? Britain was flooded with poor from all over Europe looking a piece of the wealth for which Britain is famous. It's not surprising then that there is great divide between the richest and poorest. It seems like the article implies that now that poor immigrants have been allowed into Britain, the people who built the wealthy society are now obligated to hand over all the wealth created to the new comers who didn't have anything to do with the creation of said wealth.

wolfretcrap 6y ago

Poors are screwed doesn't matter if it's EU, UK or US or even Africa. Only the magnitude of screwed differs. I've come up with an idea that we should do a swap, where a rich person is allowed to be rich for 2 years then a poor person takes his place. So the richest person swaps his place with the poorest one and vice versa.