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I think the scooters being left in the middle of the sidewalk is more a function of people being shitty, inconsiderate, and lazy. Unless the scooters self park

I think the scooters being left in the middle of the sidewalk is more a function of people being shitty, inconsiderate, and lazy. Unless the scooters self park themselves or people who dump them get shamed I don't see how that fixes itself. Personal bikes/skateboards get locked up and put out of the way because people have an active interest to keep them from getting scuffed or damaged, but that factor isn't present for a rented scooter.

vladvasiliu 5y ago
> I think the scooters being left in the middle of the sidewalk is more a function of people being shitty, inconsiderate, and lazy. Unless the scooters self park themselves or people who dump them get shamed I don't see how that fixes itself. I wholly agree. I think it's just like trash on the ground, it mostly doesn't get itself there on its own. But maybe companies should take the habits of local people into account. If you know people won't bother to leave them out of the way, maybe don't deploy your service there? Just as if you know people are going to trash your scooters, steal batteries or anything else, you won't enter that market because it will be too expensive. But I guess the latter affects the company's bottom line, whereas the former is, at worst, just bad press.
- notatoad 5y ago
  Scooters being dumped in the middle of a useful space is a function of there being literally nowhere to park a scooter. Sure, people are lazy and selfish, but they aren't so lazy that they'll continue to take the inconsiderate option if you give them a place to put the scooter. I don't see anybody suggesting car ownership should be forbidden from cities where there isn't enough parking. Why is providing parking only the responsibility of scooter companies, and not car companies? Cities adapt to meet the needs of the residents, and the needs of the residents can change. That change shouldn't be forbidden because of the current structure of our cities
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - vladvasiliu 5y ago
    > but they aren't so lazy that they'll continue to take the inconsiderate option if you give them a place to put the scooter. You'd think so. Take a stroll through the streets of Paris and then see if you still stand by this statement. Even when the sidewalk is narrow, you can leave your scooter against a wall, not across the sidewalk. You can maybe leave it 50 meters further, where the sidewalk is wider, etc. You know, try to be considerate of other people who probably don't want to have to push your scooter out of the way just because you didn't feel like taking 10 seconds to park it properly. When the infrastructure is lacking, you can either be a nuisance and argue that it's the city's fault for not providing wider sidewalks or whatever, or try to adapt to the situation while the city does something about it. Of course the cities have to adapt to the needs of their residents. But they usually are slow to do that. Now, even if I personally dislike those scooters, I won't argue for outright banning them. But at some point, I can understand people being frustrated with other people being an outright nuisance. And guess what? Paris actually has laws on the books prohibiting this (randomly blocking sidewalks, or riding a bike or motorised vehicle on them). But they are rarely enforced. So people get angry. And I figure that just as cities have to change to suit the needs of their scooter-riding residents, they also have to adapt to those of their non-scooter-riding residents, too. Now of course, the best solution would be the one which would content both parties, but politics being what they are, it's easier to ask to outright ban things. But, again, I don't think that's always the best approach and don't personally advocate for it. I actually think that it would be better to replace cars with electric scooters, and that they do need infrastructure which the city should build (and they're actually doing it). But I can't condone antisocial behaviour by scooter-riders while the city builds said infrastructure. And yes, if people apparently can't be trusted to ride them in a way which doesn't endanger or incommode others, maybe outright banning is a solution. I think "this is why we can't have nice things" applies perfectly here. Also, just because cars are a nuisance it shouldn't mean that we should accept any new nuisance. We should fight back against this, and the first step is to not worsen an already bad situation.
  - Ma8ee 5y ago

vladvasiliu 5y ago

> I think the scooters being left in the middle of the sidewalk is more a function of people being shitty, inconsiderate, and lazy. Unless the scooters self park themselves or people who dump them get shamed I don't see how that fixes itself. I wholly agree. I think it's just like trash on the ground, it mostly doesn't get itself there on its own. But maybe companies should take the habits of local people into account. If you know people won't bother to leave them out of the way, maybe don't deploy your service there? Just as if you know people are going to trash your scooters, steal batteries or anything else, you won't enter that market because it will be too expensive. But I guess the latter affects the company's bottom line, whereas the former is, at worst, just bad press.

notatoad 5y ago
Scooters being dumped in the middle of a useful space is a function of there being literally nowhere to park a scooter. Sure, people are lazy and selfish, but they aren't so lazy that they'll continue to take the inconsiderate option if you give them a place to put the scooter. I don't see anybody suggesting car ownership should be forbidden from cities where there isn't enough parking. Why is providing parking only the responsibility of scooter companies, and not car companies? Cities adapt to meet the needs of the residents, and the needs of the residents can change. That change shouldn't be forbidden because of the current structure of our cities
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- vladvasiliu 5y ago
  > but they aren't so lazy that they'll continue to take the inconsiderate option if you give them a place to put the scooter. You'd think so. Take a stroll through the streets of Paris and then see if you still stand by this statement. Even when the sidewalk is narrow, you can leave your scooter against a wall, not across the sidewalk. You can maybe leave it 50 meters further, where the sidewalk is wider, etc. You know, try to be considerate of other people who probably don't want to have to push your scooter out of the way just because you didn't feel like taking 10 seconds to park it properly. When the infrastructure is lacking, you can either be a nuisance and argue that it's the city's fault for not providing wider sidewalks or whatever, or try to adapt to the situation while the city does something about it. Of course the cities have to adapt to the needs of their residents. But they usually are slow to do that. Now, even if I personally dislike those scooters, I won't argue for outright banning them. But at some point, I can understand people being frustrated with other people being an outright nuisance. And guess what? Paris actually has laws on the books prohibiting this (randomly blocking sidewalks, or riding a bike or motorised vehicle on them). But they are rarely enforced. So people get angry. And I figure that just as cities have to change to suit the needs of their scooter-riding residents, they also have to adapt to those of their non-scooter-riding residents, too. Now of course, the best solution would be the one which would content both parties, but politics being what they are, it's easier to ask to outright ban things. But, again, I don't think that's always the best approach and don't personally advocate for it. I actually think that it would be better to replace cars with electric scooters, and that they do need infrastructure which the city should build (and they're actually doing it). But I can't condone antisocial behaviour by scooter-riders while the city builds said infrastructure. And yes, if people apparently can't be trusted to ride them in a way which doesn't endanger or incommode others, maybe outright banning is a solution. I think "this is why we can't have nice things" applies perfectly here. Also, just because cars are a nuisance it shouldn't mean that we should accept any new nuisance. We should fight back against this, and the first step is to not worsen an already bad situation.
- Ma8ee 5y ago