3 ms·

Nuclear Bomb Detection System via GPS

21 points by mattowen_uk 6y ago

helsinkiandrew 6y ago
Given the evidence about the ability to interfere with GPS communications, is it safe to assume that it would be reliable in the event of some kind of Nuclear Conflict? https://comicbook.com/gaming/news/pokemon-go-russia-cyberweapon/ https://comicbook.com/gaming/news/pokemon-go-russia-cyberwea... I thought (but have no expertise or evidence) that a network of land based detectors could pick up detonations across most of the world. Or you could build your own device to unplug your electronics in the event of a detonation: https://www.maxwell.com/images/documents/hsn1000_rev3.pdf https://www.maxwell.com/images/documents/hsn1000_rev3.pdf
- JoeDaDude 6y ago
  Not sure how the GPS NUDET system works but I suspect the downlink is something other than the navigation signal. Spoofing the navigation signal would not affect the GPS telemetry signal to dedicated NUDET ground stations. BTW, the device you linked is used exactly for that purpose, to shut down electronics to prevent damage from EMP and other effects. To your point, there are other means to detect nuclear explosions, used mostly to verify compliance with treaties, such this seismic one: https://www.osti.gov/servlets/purl/1582524 https://www.osti.gov/servlets/purl/1582524
- Daniel_sk 6y ago
  Seismic detection can be too slow if the nearest sensor is too far - it can take several minutes to hit the nearest sensor, that's too late for strategic purposes where you may need to launch a counter-attack immediately.
- jhayward 6y ago
  The presence of the detectors on the GPS constellation doesn't have anything to do with their GPS systems and functions. They're just a well-managed constellation with good coverage to hitch a ride upon. The ability to do localized surface jamming of GPS should have no effect on this function. There is an entirely separate uplink/downlink channel for satellite control. I don't know what the current generation of NUDET detectors are like, but in the early generations of satellites (pre-GPS) they were optical.
mintone 6y ago
This site is unreadable on mobile[0] and the content is very short: Nuclear Detection System The Nuclear Detonation (NUDET) Detection System (NDS) consists of space, control, and user equipment segments. The space segment consists of NUDET detection sensors on the GPS satellites. The Department of Defense and DOE now have a full constellation of 24 GPS satellites in 10,900-nautical-mile orbits capable of detecting and locating nuclear detonations worldwide, 24 hours a day. The NDS provides a worldwide, highly survivable capability to detect, locate, and report any nuclear detonations in the earth's atmosphere or near space and in near real time. The NDS supports NUDET detection requirements for AFSPC (Integrated Tactical Warning and Attack Assessment [ITWAA]), USSTRATCOM (Nuclear Force Management), and AFTAC (Treaty Monitoring). The NDS control segment consists of ground control hardware and software known as the Integrated Correlation and Display System (ICADS). The user equipment segment consists of the Ground NDS Terminals (GNT). The Lockheed-Martin Sandia Advanced Radiation Detection Capability Data Unit (ARDU) was delivered to the Air Force during FY94 and the Integrated Correlation and Display System (ICADS) began operations for the tactical warning and attack assessment community. The ARDU processes nuclear detonation (NUDET) detection data from sensors on the Defense Support Program satellites and creates a NUDET report. ICADS correlates the ARDU report with analogous data from sensors on the Global Positioning System satellites and creates overall assessment displays for Air Force operators. These reports are forwarded to national command authorities over a wide area network. Resources FY98 Budget 0305913F NUDET Detection System (Space) Arms control verification @ Sandia National Laboratory [0] https://ibb.co/jkvWkB4 https://ibb.co/jkvWkB4

21 points by mattowen_uk 6y ago

Given the evidence about the ability to interfere with GPS communications, is it safe to assume that it would be reliable in the event of some kind of Nuclear Conflict? https://comicbook.com/gaming/news/pokemon-go-russia-cyberweapon/ https://comicbook.com/gaming/news/pokemon-go-russia-cyberwea... I thought (but have no expertise or evidence) that a network of land based detectors could pick up detonations across most of the world. Or you could build your own device to unplug your electronics in the event of a detonation: https://www.maxwell.com/images/documents/hsn1000_rev3.pdf https://www.maxwell.com/images/documents/hsn1000_rev3.pdf

JoeDaDude 6y ago
Not sure how the GPS NUDET system works but I suspect the downlink is something other than the navigation signal. Spoofing the navigation signal would not affect the GPS telemetry signal to dedicated NUDET ground stations. BTW, the device you linked is used exactly for that purpose, to shut down electronics to prevent damage from EMP and other effects. To your point, there are other means to detect nuclear explosions, used mostly to verify compliance with treaties, such this seismic one: https://www.osti.gov/servlets/purl/1582524 https://www.osti.gov/servlets/purl/1582524
Daniel_sk 6y ago
Seismic detection can be too slow if the nearest sensor is too far - it can take several minutes to hit the nearest sensor, that's too late for strategic purposes where you may need to launch a counter-attack immediately.
jhayward 6y ago
The presence of the detectors on the GPS constellation doesn't have anything to do with their GPS systems and functions. They're just a well-managed constellation with good coverage to hitch a ride upon. The ability to do localized surface jamming of GPS should have no effect on this function. There is an entirely separate uplink/downlink channel for satellite control. I don't know what the current generation of NUDET detectors are like, but in the early generations of satellites (pre-GPS) they were optical.

mintone 6y ago

This site is unreadable on mobile[0] and the content is very short: Nuclear Detection System The Nuclear Detonation (NUDET) Detection System (NDS) consists of space, control, and user equipment segments. The space segment consists of NUDET detection sensors on the GPS satellites. The Department of Defense and DOE now have a full constellation of 24 GPS satellites in 10,900-nautical-mile orbits capable of detecting and locating nuclear detonations worldwide, 24 hours a day. The NDS provides a worldwide, highly survivable capability to detect, locate, and report any nuclear detonations in the earth's atmosphere or near space and in near real time. The NDS supports NUDET detection requirements for AFSPC (Integrated Tactical Warning and Attack Assessment [ITWAA]), USSTRATCOM (Nuclear Force Management), and AFTAC (Treaty Monitoring). The NDS control segment consists of ground control hardware and software known as the Integrated Correlation and Display System (ICADS). The user equipment segment consists of the Ground NDS Terminals (GNT). The Lockheed-Martin Sandia Advanced Radiation Detection Capability Data Unit (ARDU) was delivered to the Air Force during FY94 and the Integrated Correlation and Display System (ICADS) began operations for the tactical warning and attack assessment community. The ARDU processes nuclear detonation (NUDET) detection data from sensors on the Defense Support Program satellites and creates a NUDET report. ICADS correlates the ARDU report with analogous data from sensors on the Global Positioning System satellites and creates overall assessment displays for Air Force operators. These reports are forwarded to national command authorities over a wide area network. Resources FY98 Budget 0305913F NUDET Detection System (Space) Arms control verification @ Sandia National Laboratory [0] https://ibb.co/jkvWkB4 https://ibb.co/jkvWkB4