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Not going to jump in with arguments on this one. But just want to mention how positively horrified I am to see all the comments here cheering organ harvesting i

by zo1 6y ago

Not going to jump in with arguments on this one. But just want to mention how positively horrified I am to see all the comments here cheering organ harvesting in a democracy.

danparsonson 6y ago
You won't need them after you die, trust me. One (dead) person's organs can be totally life-changing for several other people but there are a shortage of donors because people forget to opt in. And if you would really prefer not to help sick people after you're dead, then you can still opt out.
pharmakom 6y ago
Can a dead person own anything? Who’s rights are violated if an organ is taken from a dead body? I would be horrified if people were killed for their organs or organs were taken while they are alive.
kaba0 6y ago
If my dead body is useful to someone, then why should it rot somewhere? It’s not like I was cared for only to have my liver harvested, so it makes zero chance to compare it to deliberate killing of people.
- zo1 6y ago
  Because morality should not be based on what "makes sense" or is an efficient use of things. The reason I used the term "organ harvesting" is the same reason people that talk about this "opt out" thing use the term "donation". But my overall feeling is that this is yet another thing that highlights and brings to the fore that the state pretty much owns us as essentially livestock to harvest things from. At the very least, the default should be that your estate and/or your family takes ownership of your remains. Otherwise we're heading into territory where the state can say: "Why should you have a grave so your body can rot in there. It's not like we're going around killing you for your biological matter, so it's okay if we just take your body and decompose it into fertilizer to help rejuvenate the farm fields!" or "We've determined that you don't need 10% of the blood that you generate every day, so please make sure to go daily to your local "Blood donation centre" for your "voluntary donation""! The way people are cheering this "donation" on is frankly very disturbing. Yes, I know it saves lives, but so would abolishing cars to stop car accidents and so would banning all knives and having people use feeding tubes instead!
  - kaba0 6y ago
    That’s a huge hyperbole. Governments are not dictators. They are a democratically elected body that is given power by the people to enact laws. With proper separation of power (this is the most important!), this power can be revoked anytime. They are absolutely not infallible of course, but they are the best formation we managed to come up with. So we have governments at the present time, and let’s say a power grab were to happen. Then does it really matter that we had such a law now? They can then do whatever they want with or without laws, so your fear is baseless. It is a good decision that will save lives and is basically without price.
  - robjan 6y ago
    When you are an organ donor in the UK, they still ask your family and follow their wishes. The family can override the default or even the wishes of the deceased if they really want.

by zo1 6y ago

Not going to jump in with arguments on this one. But just want to mention how positively horrified I am to see all the comments here cheering organ harvesting in a democracy.

danparsonson 6y ago

You won't need them after you die, trust me. One (dead) person's organs can be totally life-changing for several other people but there are a shortage of donors because people forget to opt in. And if you would really prefer not to help sick people after you're dead, then you can still opt out.

pharmakom 6y ago

Can a dead person own anything? Who’s rights are violated if an organ is taken from a dead body? I would be horrified if people were killed for their organs or organs were taken while they are alive.

kaba0 6y ago

If my dead body is useful to someone, then why should it rot somewhere? It’s not like I was cared for only to have my liver harvested, so it makes zero chance to compare it to deliberate killing of people.

zo1 6y ago
Because morality should not be based on what "makes sense" or is an efficient use of things. The reason I used the term "organ harvesting" is the same reason people that talk about this "opt out" thing use the term "donation". But my overall feeling is that this is yet another thing that highlights and brings to the fore that the state pretty much owns us as essentially livestock to harvest things from. At the very least, the default should be that your estate and/or your family takes ownership of your remains. Otherwise we're heading into territory where the state can say: "Why should you have a grave so your body can rot in there. It's not like we're going around killing you for your biological matter, so it's okay if we just take your body and decompose it into fertilizer to help rejuvenate the farm fields!" or "We've determined that you don't need 10% of the blood that you generate every day, so please make sure to go daily to your local "Blood donation centre" for your "voluntary donation""! The way people are cheering this "donation" on is frankly very disturbing. Yes, I know it saves lives, but so would abolishing cars to stop car accidents and so would banning all knives and having people use feeding tubes instead!
- kaba0 6y ago
  That’s a huge hyperbole. Governments are not dictators. They are a democratically elected body that is given power by the people to enact laws. With proper separation of power (this is the most important!), this power can be revoked anytime. They are absolutely not infallible of course, but they are the best formation we managed to come up with. So we have governments at the present time, and let’s say a power grab were to happen. Then does it really matter that we had such a law now? They can then do whatever they want with or without laws, so your fear is baseless. It is a good decision that will save lives and is basically without price.
- robjan 6y ago
  When you are an organ donor in the UK, they still ask your family and follow their wishes. The family can override the default or even the wishes of the deceased if they really want.