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Apple has a monopoly for apps stores on iOS devices. > A monopoly exists when a specific person or enterprise is the only supplier of a particular commodity.

Apple has a monopoly for apps stores on iOS devices. > A monopoly exists when a specific person or enterprise is the only supplier of a particular commodity. Commodity: Apps sales on iOS. Only supplier: Apple. Apple use their monopolistic market position to enforce a 30% levy on third parties. It has nothing at all to do with Google, since Google cannot compete with Apple to provide app stores on iOS. Even bringing Google up is an attempt to shift the conversation from the app store situation on iOS to something off-topic and irrelevant (handset market share). That's not what we're discussing. Let's go through the markers of a monopoly: - Profit maximizer: Maximizes profits. Yes. - Price maker: Decides the price of the good or product to be sold, but does so by determining the quantity in order to demand the price desired by the firm. Yes. - Single seller: In a monopoly, there is one seller of the good, who produces all the output. Therefore, the whole market is being served by a single company, and for practical purposes, the company is the same as the industry. Yes, Apple is the exclusive provider. - Price discrimination: A monopolist can change the price or quantity of the product. Yes. So the Appe Store on iOS checks all the markers of a monopoly. But people want to pretend the monopoly designation can only apply to traditional market segments without justification.

hellisothers 6y ago
This argument falls apart when you consider anybody is the sole provider of anything. I’m the sole provider of my approval, therefore I’m a monopoly? So then you have to decide at what scale this argument makes sense and nobody is going to agree on that.
threeseed 6y ago
iOS App Stores is not an industry though any more than Tesla car operating systems or Ikea screws are. They are intrinsic parts of the objects and have never existed independently of them.
- Someone1234 6y ago
  See United States v. Microsoft Corp. That was a landmark decision that essentially says that things like the App Store are in fact eligible to be declared monopolies for the purposes of anti-trust.
- chomp 6y ago
  There is no market in those two examples. No one buys Tesla operating systems, and no one buys IKEA screws. In both cases, those are building blocks of the whole. You must have a market before you can abuse it. In addition, you must have a firm and durable market power. If IKEA had a strong screw market across multiple segments, and then abused that position through exclusionary practices, you could argue a potential illegal monopoly. Likewise, if Tesla operating systems were closer to 90’s Microsoft, you could have an argument there. Notice no one is arguing an iOS monopoly. The App Store fits the legal definition of a market. Apple has a firm and durable market power (over 50% in multiple countries, including the US, which is their highest revenue). Apple excludes some from this app market. Apple can and does prevent certain firms from succeeding in their marketplace. It is not unheard of to have Apple reject or pull apps once they decide that they want to add that app’s feature to iOS. Once the app is pulled into iOS, it gains functionality not available to other apps. Their monopoly was gained not by innovation, but by the fact that they set the rules of this market - you simply cannot make a competing App Store. These are red flags and should be investigated.
dylan604 6y ago
>- Price maker: Decides the price of the good or product to be sold, but does so by determining the quantity in order to demand the price desired by the firm. >Yes. We are talking the app store here, right? How does Apple set the prices of the apps? The devs release their apps at the price they want. Free, Freemium, Paid, In App Purchases, etc. >- Price discrimination: A monopolist can change the price or quantity of the product. >Yes. Again, how is Apple changing the prices of apps on the app store? >So the Appe Store on iOS checks all the markers of a monopoly. But people want to pretend the monopoly designation can only apply to traditional market segments without justification. Clearly, I'm disagreeing with this summation.
- Someone1234 6y ago
  > We are talking the app store here, right? How does Apple set the prices of the apps? Yes we're talking about the app STORE not the apps. Apple exclusively sets the price for the store the apps are sold on (and any services the apps sell): 30% (+- first $1M). > The devs release their apps at the price they want. We're talking about what Apple charges developers, not what developers charge customers.
deleted 6y ago
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gnicholas 6y ago
> Apple has a monopoly for apps stores on iOS devices. I spent a summer interning for the CA DOJ's antitrust division. The first thing I learned is that the determination of the relevant market is extremely important, and often outcome-determinative. If the relevant market is drawn broadly, then it's much less likely that a company will be considered to have a monopoly; if the the relevant market is drawn narrowly, it will be much more likely. The question for Apple/Google is: is the 'relevant market' the market for distributing apps on their own platform, or for smartphones in general? There's no way to know in advance how a court would come down on this question, and it would have a huge impact on the outcome of the trial.

hellisothers 6y ago

This argument falls apart when you consider anybody is the sole provider of anything. I’m the sole provider of my approval, therefore I’m a monopoly? So then you have to decide at what scale this argument makes sense and nobody is going to agree on that.

threeseed 6y ago

iOS App Stores is not an industry though any more than Tesla car operating systems or Ikea screws are. They are intrinsic parts of the objects and have never existed independently of them.

Someone1234 6y ago
See United States v. Microsoft Corp. That was a landmark decision that essentially says that things like the App Store are in fact eligible to be declared monopolies for the purposes of anti-trust.
chomp 6y ago
There is no market in those two examples. No one buys Tesla operating systems, and no one buys IKEA screws. In both cases, those are building blocks of the whole. You must have a market before you can abuse it. In addition, you must have a firm and durable market power. If IKEA had a strong screw market across multiple segments, and then abused that position through exclusionary practices, you could argue a potential illegal monopoly. Likewise, if Tesla operating systems were closer to 90’s Microsoft, you could have an argument there. Notice no one is arguing an iOS monopoly. The App Store fits the legal definition of a market. Apple has a firm and durable market power (over 50% in multiple countries, including the US, which is their highest revenue). Apple excludes some from this app market. Apple can and does prevent certain firms from succeeding in their marketplace. It is not unheard of to have Apple reject or pull apps once they decide that they want to add that app’s feature to iOS. Once the app is pulled into iOS, it gains functionality not available to other apps. Their monopoly was gained not by innovation, but by the fact that they set the rules of this market - you simply cannot make a competing App Store. These are red flags and should be investigated.

dylan604 6y ago

>- Price maker: Decides the price of the good or product to be sold, but does so by determining the quantity in order to demand the price desired by the firm. >Yes. We are talking the app store here, right? How does Apple set the prices of the apps? The devs release their apps at the price they want. Free, Freemium, Paid, In App Purchases, etc. >- Price discrimination: A monopolist can change the price or quantity of the product. >Yes. Again, how is Apple changing the prices of apps on the app store? >So the Appe Store on iOS checks all the markers of a monopoly. But people want to pretend the monopoly designation can only apply to traditional market segments without justification. Clearly, I'm disagreeing with this summation.

Someone1234 6y ago
> We are talking the app store here, right? How does Apple set the prices of the apps? Yes we're talking about the app STORE not the apps. Apple exclusively sets the price for the store the apps are sold on (and any services the apps sell): 30% (+- first $1M). > The devs release their apps at the price they want. We're talking about what Apple charges developers, not what developers charge customers.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

gnicholas 6y ago

> Apple has a monopoly for apps stores on iOS devices. I spent a summer interning for the CA DOJ's antitrust division. The first thing I learned is that the determination of the relevant market is extremely important, and often outcome-determinative. If the relevant market is drawn broadly, then it's much less likely that a company will be considered to have a monopoly; if the the relevant market is drawn narrowly, it will be much more likely. The question for Apple/Google is: is the 'relevant market' the market for distributing apps on their own platform, or for smartphones in general? There's no way to know in advance how a court would come down on this question, and it would have a huge impact on the outcome of the trial.