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I'll never understand this. You presumably are biking on the street, at best in a bike lane, at worst in the shoulder, and are placing so much confidence in ot

I'll never understand this. You presumably are biking on the street, at best in a bike lane, at worst in the shoulder, and are placing so much confidence in other people to not hit you. Given how SHIT other people are at driving, I have no desire whatsoever to be on a bicycle in front of them.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
JamilD 6y ago
I wonder how we escape this trap. Cars are 1-2 ton machines that can kill you as a cyclist or pedestrian, and humans are awful at operating them. The solution is therefore apparently to put more of those machines on the road (for self-protection) instead of reducing the risk altogether?
- rubicon33 6y ago
  Yea, it's a conundrum. I personally would love nothing more than to cycle to work, but it's not worth the risk of serious injury or death. The only solution I can see is at a city level legislating bicycle only roads which are totally void of vehicles.
shafyy 6y ago
It's important that cities build great biking infrastructure to alleviate this problem. At the same time, this is used by a lot of people as an excuse to not get a bike. In fact, it's not that dangerous as you make it out to be as is proven by statistics I guess (didn't look them up)
- lemming 6y ago
  Here are the stats for New Zealand: https://ehinz.ac.nz/indicators/transport/road-traffic-injury-deaths-and-hospitalisations/#motorcyclists-were-at-much-greater-risk-of-injury-or-death-per-time-spent-travelling https://ehinz.ac.nz/indicators/transport/road-traffic-injury... Bikes are definitely far more dangerous than cars. Not as much as motorcycles, but that’s scant comfort.
  - shafyy 6y ago
    This is a bit misleading. With bikes, you usually only do a couple of km per day, whereas with your car you probably do 10x that. If you look at the absolute number of deaths, biking is reasonably safe. As I said before, cities can do a lot to make it even safer, such as good bikelanes, better traffic lights for turns, better driver's education and so on.
    - lemming 6y ago
      Not really - most of this subthread is about people replacing their use of a car with a bike. In that case, you have to do the same number of km. They're probably not people who commute 50 km each way, but there aren't that many of those anyway. I also disagree with looking at absolute numbers. Of course bikes look better there because compared to cars, very few people cycle in most places. Relative numbers are the only ones that make sense. Apart from this, I drive and cycle, and it seems obvious to me that cycling is considerably more dangerous. Everyone I know who cycles accepts that it's a case of when, not if, something goes wrong, and the consequences are obviously much worse on a bike.
analog31 6y ago
I'm a cyclist, and use my bike to get around town, though I also own a car. Of course I can't completely dismiss your sentiment. Possibly my most important safety measure is route choice. The streets that I ride on have very little car traffic. This includes separated bike paths, but also quiet neighborhood streets. Fortunately this is possible in the town where I live. In decades of riding, I've never experienced a collision with a car, and my near-misses have been rare.
- anon776 6y ago
  This 100%. When I bike to work I take a route that is 2 miles longer than when I drive. Just to avoid a few left turns and a few busy roads witch sketchy bike lanes. Now that I have an e-bike the commute is actually really fun and I get to work with energy.
Pxtl 6y ago
The only way that changes if cities get better cycling infrastructure, and the only way they get better infrastructure is if they stand up and get counted on the road.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

JamilD 6y ago

I wonder how we escape this trap. Cars are 1-2 ton machines that can kill you as a cyclist or pedestrian, and humans are awful at operating them. The solution is therefore apparently to put more of those machines on the road (for self-protection) instead of reducing the risk altogether?

rubicon33 6y ago
Yea, it's a conundrum. I personally would love nothing more than to cycle to work, but it's not worth the risk of serious injury or death. The only solution I can see is at a city level legislating bicycle only roads which are totally void of vehicles.

shafyy 6y ago

It's important that cities build great biking infrastructure to alleviate this problem. At the same time, this is used by a lot of people as an excuse to not get a bike. In fact, it's not that dangerous as you make it out to be as is proven by statistics I guess (didn't look them up)

lemming 6y ago
Here are the stats for New Zealand: https://ehinz.ac.nz/indicators/transport/road-traffic-injury-deaths-and-hospitalisations/#motorcyclists-were-at-much-greater-risk-of-injury-or-death-per-time-spent-travelling https://ehinz.ac.nz/indicators/transport/road-traffic-injury... Bikes are definitely far more dangerous than cars. Not as much as motorcycles, but that’s scant comfort.
- shafyy 6y ago
  This is a bit misleading. With bikes, you usually only do a couple of km per day, whereas with your car you probably do 10x that. If you look at the absolute number of deaths, biking is reasonably safe. As I said before, cities can do a lot to make it even safer, such as good bikelanes, better traffic lights for turns, better driver's education and so on.
  - lemming 6y ago
    Not really - most of this subthread is about people replacing their use of a car with a bike. In that case, you have to do the same number of km. They're probably not people who commute 50 km each way, but there aren't that many of those anyway. I also disagree with looking at absolute numbers. Of course bikes look better there because compared to cars, very few people cycle in most places. Relative numbers are the only ones that make sense. Apart from this, I drive and cycle, and it seems obvious to me that cycling is considerably more dangerous. Everyone I know who cycles accepts that it's a case of when, not if, something goes wrong, and the consequences are obviously much worse on a bike.

analog31 6y ago

I'm a cyclist, and use my bike to get around town, though I also own a car. Of course I can't completely dismiss your sentiment. Possibly my most important safety measure is route choice. The streets that I ride on have very little car traffic. This includes separated bike paths, but also quiet neighborhood streets. Fortunately this is possible in the town where I live. In decades of riding, I've never experienced a collision with a car, and my near-misses have been rare.

anon776 6y ago
This 100%. When I bike to work I take a route that is 2 miles longer than when I drive. Just to avoid a few left turns and a few busy roads witch sketchy bike lanes. Now that I have an e-bike the commute is actually really fun and I get to work with energy.

Pxtl 6y ago

The only way that changes if cities get better cycling infrastructure, and the only way they get better infrastructure is if they stand up and get counted on the road.