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Racism, gore, pedos, endless endless pornography... Yet when people mention that they visit 4chan, they talk about the 'very clever people posting there'. It's

Racism, gore, pedos, endless endless pornography... Yet when people mention that they visit 4chan, they talk about the 'very clever people posting there'. It's like mentioning that you regularly go paddling in your local river in order to collect tiny nuggets of gold, without mentioning that your local river is a flow of excrement, nuclear waste, and malignant psychopaths.

factsaresacred 5y ago
You could be describing Twitter.
ggvvfdde 5y ago
It's funny. I've been browsing 4chan all month and I havent seen any gore or pedos. Maybe a few leud pictures (less than 10). Maybe you should actually visit the site instead of just spreading misinformation.
- ineedasername 5y ago
  I took you up on that, and visited the technology interest area /g/ Post #1: Comment using the N word Post #2: Someone using "fag" to insult people who, presumably, use Arch linux. (The term was Archfags) Post #3: In response to something about headphones: "that deaf faggot [n-word]" So it's funny. I've been browsing 4chan for 5 minutes and couldn't avoid racism & homophobia in the very first things I saw. Maybe you should actually visit the site instead of just spreading misinformation.
  - matheusmoreira 5y ago
    If you visit anonymous imageboards, it's because you want to be exposed to the widest possible spectrum of humanity. There's a bias towards being offensive simply because those things are not allowed to surface anywhere else. If you stick around despite that, you'll realize the site has a rather unique culture. Occasionally, you'll run into great stuff that could never be expressed in sites such as this one. You mentioned /g/ -- there is a daily programming thread on that board with a very long history. I've seen some really interesting projects posted there. Some even made their way here eventually. SerenityOS for example.
    - ineedasername 5y ago
      I can understand that sometimes there's decent bit of non-hate content on 4chan, but what sort of great content would you find there that couldn't be expressed here, or in some other forum that isn't full of hatred?
      - bumblelad 5y ago
        Seeing your comments on a few other parts of this thread makes me think that it's probably better for you not to bother with 4chan. As others have kindly explained to you, insults on there are facetious as well as self describing, and of course, derogatory. If you can't, or rather won't, see beyond that. Then it's just not for you. And that's fine.
        ineedasername 5y ago
        You are correct, hate speech is not for me, and when possible I stay away from places where it would otherwise be unavoidable. But what people have "kindly" explained have merely been justifications for racism and other hate speech that all seem to ultimately boil down to it being normal for 4chan. That, and the excuse of "oh but they don't really mean it" is pretty thin justification.
        matheusmoreira 5y ago
        It is normal there. These elements surface on anonymous forums precisely because they are not tolerated elsewhere. A very simple pattern of 4chan posting culture is to offend others in order to provoke a debate about what you actually want to discuss. It's the 4chan version of clickbait. The /g/ catalog is absolutely filled with people doing this. Want to talk about Linux? Pretend you're a superior Windows user and mock Linux for not having some feature. File picker thumbnails are a common example. This happens all the time and can generate some rather unique discussions. Because it's anonymous, you'll see a lot of frowned-upon behavior which can nevertheless be interesting. Everytime some drama happens on GitHub or LKML there might be a random 4chan thread discussing it in the usual offensive tone. It's interesting to read about what people think, especially opinions they wouldn't express if they had to sign the post with their real names.
  - Thorentis 5y ago
    So we went from "it's nothing but pedos and porn" to "there are some bad words on there". If you find that offensive, maybe stay away from the internet.
    - ineedasername 5y ago
      Racism and homophobia aren't just bad words, and they were literally in the first three things I looked at. If you find that hard to understand, maybe stay away from HN where we try to have at least some minimum of reason in our discussions: you either lack that by minimizing racism and hatred to "bad words" or you are a troll arguing in bad faith.
      - Thorentis 5y ago
        I think you are the one doing the conflating. You've jumped from "these words are sometimes used" to "these words are used solely for the purpose of expressing racist and homophobic feelings".
        solosoyokaze 5y ago
        > "these words are used solely for the purpose of expressing racist and homophobic feelings". There's no other way to use these words. They're always racist and homophobic. That's the point, /pol is a cesspool of racism and homophobia.
        Blikkentrekker 5y ago
        They clearly can, and are in this case used, to communicate information where neither the listener nor the speaker is even thinking about race or sexual orientation, and no comment thereon is made. If you wish to still call that “racism and homophobia”, then neither of which necessarily has anything to do with race or sexual orientations, or even disdain. — you should also know that your usage of these words is then quite nonstandard, and does not align with what most mean with them. The word “nigger”, in particular, has been of particular interest of study in how depending on context the word can very much be about race, and negatively so, to a simple form of address that has no implications of race.
  - scpedicini 5y ago
    He specifically refuted the claim that it was "pedophilia and gore"; your response, while raising valid criticisms, has nothing to do with those two things.
  - kderbyma 5y ago
    technically....it's a culture clash. those words mean different things than Merriam Websters...... it's offensive to outsiders....to keep them out lol
    - solosoyokaze 5y ago
      It's offensive to everyone who's not a racist. Is that your definition of "outsider"? What do you think those words mean?
      - Hacker29382 5y ago
        On 4chan, the -fag suffix is barely offensive and can even be a term of endearment.
        solosoyokaze 5y ago
        It’s offensive off 4chan, it doesn’t matter what they think.
        nathanasmith 5y ago
        >it doesn’t matter what they think A thought provoking message. Just quoting it for posterity. Carry on.
- GauntletWizard 5y ago
  I used to see pedo pics on 4chan... occasionally, if not frequently. That was well before the site gained it's alt-right reputation, though, back when it was more focused on simply "internet outcasts" and very gay friendly.
- sudosysgen 5y ago
  Go on /b/. You will see pedo shit if you look for loli threads - as I assume they contain pedo images - and quite a bit of gore too. It's definitely there. Not in /pol/, but /pol/ is a subset of 4chan.
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JohnBooty 5y ago
very clever people posting there Cleverness is orthogonal to depravity, right? Nobody denies the extreme cesspool-like aspects of some corners of 4chan. The one thing you can uncontroversially say is that 4chan is diverse. It's almost like reddit, where each subreddit has its own distinct culture, mods, etc. I would say that overall, 4ch does attract... a pretty clever crowd. Almost everything there is layer upon layer upon layer of self-reference and iteration. Meta on top of meta on top of meta. Not saying you have to be a genius to "get it" but I don't see a dummy enjoying it. I'm also saying this as somebody who doesn't particularly like the place. I grew out of that shock humor stuff about two decades ago.
- ineedasername 5y ago
  Cleverness is unfortunately not orthogonal to depravity or any number of other awful things. It would be a much better world if most hateful people or those who want to do bad things were also not very smart. Although I'm also not sure how clever a person really needs to be to understand multiple layers of meta: "Meta" is so ingrained in cultural DNA at this point that anyone born in the last 25 years will understand all of it on nearly an intuitive level, and anyone over that age will still have been bombarded by it for decades-- long enough to mostly still get it.
Blikkentrekker 5y ago
Most boards on 4chan are designated safe for work and racism free, and will quickly earn one a global three day ban for posting pornography and gore. This is very strictly enforced in practice, one doesn't see any nudity or gore remain up on those boards for more than ten minutes before a janitor catches it. Pornography is allowed on all boards that aren't designated “safe for work”, but gore is only allowed on a very select few.
- ineedasername 5y ago
  Vitriolic hate speech seems to be allowed just about everywhere. Browsing through the first three items in Technology /g/ showed me 2 instances of homophobic and 2 instances of racism. One of them hit both at the same time with "faggot [n-word]". In general I have much less of a problem with porn or gore than I do with raging hatred.
  - andyxor 5y ago
    raging hatred is all over the news though, and pretty much gone mainstream. have you heard of BLM, it is probably the most racist vile hate movement since the KKK and it's so in vogue right now.
    - matchbok 5y ago
      KKK: Murdered hundreds of people. BLM: "Please stop killing black people" Yup, totally the same. You're insane. Get off 4chan, champ.
    - ineedasername 5y ago
      Are you trying to say that raging hatred on 4Chan is acceptable because raging hatred exists in other areas too? That would be a strange thing to say, but I don't know what you're getting at otherwise.
      - andyxor 5y ago
        it's kind of strange to pay attention to a fringe internet forum when you have mainstream media, like CNN, WaPo, NBC etc broadcasting conspiracy theories on "white supremacists", "white privilege", "systemic racism", "critical race theory", and other racist divisive bs every day for years now, not to mention inciting riots and violence on the streets. Especially when they openly admit doing this for political reasons.
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factsaresacred 5y ago

You could be describing Twitter.

ggvvfdde 5y ago

It's funny. I've been browsing 4chan all month and I havent seen any gore or pedos. Maybe a few leud pictures (less than 10). Maybe you should actually visit the site instead of just spreading misinformation.

ineedasername 5y ago
I took you up on that, and visited the technology interest area /g/ Post #1: Comment using the N word Post #2: Someone using "fag" to insult people who, presumably, use Arch linux. (The term was Archfags) Post #3: In response to something about headphones: "that deaf faggot [n-word]" So it's funny. I've been browsing 4chan for 5 minutes and couldn't avoid racism & homophobia in the very first things I saw. Maybe you should actually visit the site instead of just spreading misinformation.
- matheusmoreira 5y ago
  If you visit anonymous imageboards, it's because you want to be exposed to the widest possible spectrum of humanity. There's a bias towards being offensive simply because those things are not allowed to surface anywhere else. If you stick around despite that, you'll realize the site has a rather unique culture. Occasionally, you'll run into great stuff that could never be expressed in sites such as this one. You mentioned /g/ -- there is a daily programming thread on that board with a very long history. I've seen some really interesting projects posted there. Some even made their way here eventually. SerenityOS for example.
  - ineedasername 5y ago
    I can understand that sometimes there's decent bit of non-hate content on 4chan, but what sort of great content would you find there that couldn't be expressed here, or in some other forum that isn't full of hatred?
    - bumblelad 5y ago
      Seeing your comments on a few other parts of this thread makes me think that it's probably better for you not to bother with 4chan. As others have kindly explained to you, insults on there are facetious as well as self describing, and of course, derogatory. If you can't, or rather won't, see beyond that. Then it's just not for you. And that's fine.
      - ineedasername 5y ago
        You are correct, hate speech is not for me, and when possible I stay away from places where it would otherwise be unavoidable. But what people have "kindly" explained have merely been justifications for racism and other hate speech that all seem to ultimately boil down to it being normal for 4chan. That, and the excuse of "oh but they don't really mean it" is pretty thin justification.
        matheusmoreira 5y ago
        It is normal there. These elements surface on anonymous forums precisely because they are not tolerated elsewhere. A very simple pattern of 4chan posting culture is to offend others in order to provoke a debate about what you actually want to discuss. It's the 4chan version of clickbait. The /g/ catalog is absolutely filled with people doing this. Want to talk about Linux? Pretend you're a superior Windows user and mock Linux for not having some feature. File picker thumbnails are a common example. This happens all the time and can generate some rather unique discussions. Because it's anonymous, you'll see a lot of frowned-upon behavior which can nevertheless be interesting. Everytime some drama happens on GitHub or LKML there might be a random 4chan thread discussing it in the usual offensive tone. It's interesting to read about what people think, especially opinions they wouldn't express if they had to sign the post with their real names.
- Thorentis 5y ago
  So we went from "it's nothing but pedos and porn" to "there are some bad words on there". If you find that offensive, maybe stay away from the internet.
  - ineedasername 5y ago
    Racism and homophobia aren't just bad words, and they were literally in the first three things I looked at. If you find that hard to understand, maybe stay away from HN where we try to have at least some minimum of reason in our discussions: you either lack that by minimizing racism and hatred to "bad words" or you are a troll arguing in bad faith.
    - Thorentis 5y ago
      I think you are the one doing the conflating. You've jumped from "these words are sometimes used" to "these words are used solely for the purpose of expressing racist and homophobic feelings".
      - solosoyokaze 5y ago
        > "these words are used solely for the purpose of expressing racist and homophobic feelings". There's no other way to use these words. They're always racist and homophobic. That's the point, /pol is a cesspool of racism and homophobia.
        Blikkentrekker 5y ago
        They clearly can, and are in this case used, to communicate information where neither the listener nor the speaker is even thinking about race or sexual orientation, and no comment thereon is made. If you wish to still call that “racism and homophobia”, then neither of which necessarily has anything to do with race or sexual orientations, or even disdain. — you should also know that your usage of these words is then quite nonstandard, and does not align with what most mean with them. The word “nigger”, in particular, has been of particular interest of study in how depending on context the word can very much be about race, and negatively so, to a simple form of address that has no implications of race.
- scpedicini 5y ago
  He specifically refuted the claim that it was "pedophilia and gore"; your response, while raising valid criticisms, has nothing to do with those two things.
- kderbyma 5y ago
  technically....it's a culture clash. those words mean different things than Merriam Websters...... it's offensive to outsiders....to keep them out lol
  - solosoyokaze 5y ago
    It's offensive to everyone who's not a racist. Is that your definition of "outsider"? What do you think those words mean?
    - Hacker29382 5y ago
      On 4chan, the -fag suffix is barely offensive and can even be a term of endearment.
      - solosoyokaze 5y ago
        It’s offensive off 4chan, it doesn’t matter what they think.
        nathanasmith 5y ago
        >it doesn’t matter what they think A thought provoking message. Just quoting it for posterity. Carry on.
GauntletWizard 5y ago
I used to see pedo pics on 4chan... occasionally, if not frequently. That was well before the site gained it's alt-right reputation, though, back when it was more focused on simply "internet outcasts" and very gay friendly.
sudosysgen 5y ago
Go on /b/. You will see pedo shit if you look for loli threads - as I assume they contain pedo images - and quite a bit of gore too. It's definitely there. Not in /pol/, but /pol/ is a subset of 4chan.

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JohnBooty 5y ago

very clever people posting there Cleverness is orthogonal to depravity, right? Nobody denies the extreme cesspool-like aspects of some corners of 4chan. The one thing you can uncontroversially say is that 4chan is diverse. It's almost like reddit, where each subreddit has its own distinct culture, mods, etc. I would say that overall, 4ch does attract... a pretty clever crowd. Almost everything there is layer upon layer upon layer of self-reference and iteration. Meta on top of meta on top of meta. Not saying you have to be a genius to "get it" but I don't see a dummy enjoying it. I'm also saying this as somebody who doesn't particularly like the place. I grew out of that shock humor stuff about two decades ago.

ineedasername 5y ago
Cleverness is unfortunately not orthogonal to depravity or any number of other awful things. It would be a much better world if most hateful people or those who want to do bad things were also not very smart. Although I'm also not sure how clever a person really needs to be to understand multiple layers of meta: "Meta" is so ingrained in cultural DNA at this point that anyone born in the last 25 years will understand all of it on nearly an intuitive level, and anyone over that age will still have been bombarded by it for decades-- long enough to mostly still get it.

Blikkentrekker 5y ago

Most boards on 4chan are designated safe for work and racism free, and will quickly earn one a global three day ban for posting pornography and gore. This is very strictly enforced in practice, one doesn't see any nudity or gore remain up on those boards for more than ten minutes before a janitor catches it. Pornography is allowed on all boards that aren't designated “safe for work”, but gore is only allowed on a very select few.

ineedasername 5y ago
Vitriolic hate speech seems to be allowed just about everywhere. Browsing through the first three items in Technology /g/ showed me 2 instances of homophobic and 2 instances of racism. One of them hit both at the same time with "faggot [n-word]". In general I have much less of a problem with porn or gore than I do with raging hatred.
- andyxor 5y ago
  raging hatred is all over the news though, and pretty much gone mainstream. have you heard of BLM, it is probably the most racist vile hate movement since the KKK and it's so in vogue right now.
  - matchbok 5y ago
    KKK: Murdered hundreds of people. BLM: "Please stop killing black people" Yup, totally the same. You're insane. Get off 4chan, champ.
  - ineedasername 5y ago
    Are you trying to say that raging hatred on 4Chan is acceptable because raging hatred exists in other areas too? That would be a strange thing to say, but I don't know what you're getting at otherwise.
    - andyxor 5y ago
      it's kind of strange to pay attention to a fringe internet forum when you have mainstream media, like CNN, WaPo, NBC etc broadcasting conspiracy theories on "white supremacists", "white privilege", "systemic racism", "critical race theory", and other racist divisive bs every day for years now, not to mention inciting riots and violence on the streets. Especially when they openly admit doing this for political reasons.

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