5 ms·

Err here in the United States you have people pissing in bottles and bags because they can't take a break without missing targets. The West is not immune to pre

Err here in the United States you have people pissing in bottles and bags because they can't take a break without missing targets. The West is not immune to predatory hiring and employment practices.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
peteretep 6y ago
I have pissed in a bottle before out of expediency, but I've never spent several years stranded on a ship without power, company, etc, out of free will. Conflating the two seems weird.
- Klinky 6y ago
  Do you piss in a bottle on a daily basis as part of your job? Comparing peeing in a bottle [a few times in your life] for expediency compared to doing it on the daily, seems to be its own conflation.
  - peteretep 6y ago
    If my current workplace offered me a 15% raise in exchange for forgoing toilet breaks and pissing in a bottle for the next year, I would go for it. I'm sure there's a number for which I'd agree to be stranded on a boat off the coast of Egypt without power, but I suspect it's closer to 15x my salary. As I understand it, this makes the latter 100x worse than the former.
    - Klinky 6y ago
      No, you'd need to compare the actual job that requires you to piss in a bottle, along with its salary, not your current job with a 15% bonus tacked on. Also people don't sign up to be abandoned on a ship, they're not told of that possibility, until it happens. They signed up to be merchant marines or seaman, not prisoners of ghost ships. Just because you find getting bit by a dog more palatable than falling into a pit of snakes, doesn't make getting bit by a dog okay or acceptable.
  - unishark 6y ago
    Private investigators have to do this routinely. Of course they are probably self-employed. OSHA laws require companies allow bathroom breaks though.
  - stickfigure 6y ago
    I piss in bottles and on the sides of roads on road trips. Sometimes daily, depending on the length of the trip. You make it sound like some great injustice. It's just pissing in a bottle, who cares? It's pretty offensive to compare this to being held prisoner on a ship.
    - dredmorbius 6y ago
      Doing something freely of choice with no (or very mimial) downside risk, and doing it at the penalty of losing ones jobs, whilst the employer denies the practice, have substantial daylight between them.
      - stickfigure 6y ago
        I can only assume you have some very deep seated issues around urine and urination? With a totally straight face, you're comparing pissing in bottles with being imprisoned for four years. Amazon could demand full bottles at close of workday, and then pour it on your head, and this comparison would still be farcical. Recalibrate your outrage. I'm going to blow your mind: RV toilets are just giant bottles with levers and valves.
        dredmorbius 6y ago
        I am comparing the case of urinating on a roadtrip as a means to save a few minutes on arrival time, with a significant labour force being obligated to do so under terms and conditions of employment whilst their employer loudly and publicly denies this fact. (The fact that the employer later retracted the denail doesn't obviate the predicate clause.) Your reading of my statement is far from the mark, curiously so.
        Klinky 6y ago
        Please start peeing in bottles daily as part of your job, and let your co-workers know about, note their reaction. This discussion is about unacceptable work hazards, not exclusively about being imprisoned on a ship.
unreal37 6y ago
It seems fairly easy to get a union if a workplace wants one...
- Ar-Curunir 6y ago
  Right, ask Amazon workers about that.
  - fennecfoxen 6y ago
    The warehouse workers down in Alabama? Why would you ask them? They didn't want one. It wasn't close at all, either.
    - Ar-Curunir 6y ago
      Because Amazon moving killed all other local work opportunities, and also because Amazon did not allow workers access to union organizers and information. The case is probably going to go the NRLB which will rule the election illegal.
      - fennecfoxen 6y ago
        It wasn't a close thing. It was a blowout, substantially worse than 2-to-1 against. (1,798—738). Maybe you're right, and there will be lawsuits. That's a far cry from saying that the workers there wanted a union.
  - unreal37 6y ago
    That's my point. They did ask them, and they said no.
open0 6y ago
Ever been enslaved on a Thai fishing boat? I know a few people who have, including a neighbor that was missing for 3 years. The US has its own problems, but places like Dubai, Southeast Asia, etc. have a much more severe problem with mistreatment and abuse of workers. Last year a building collapsed here during construction and killed about 60 people. Stuff like that happens all the time.
- Ar-Curunir 6y ago
  I lived in Gulf countries for 12 years; I'm well aware of the shitty and life-threatening work conditions for migrant labourers. I've also lived in the US for 9 years; I'm also well aware of the mistreatment of workers here, such as workers who are undocumented migrants, workers who are prisoners, workers who work gig companies, Amazon workers, and many others.
  - tacocataco 6y ago
    The common theme here is humans are excellent at externalizing costs. Jeff bezos is not pissing in a bottle. The people who profit the most from these ships are never trapped on them.
- runarberg 6y ago
  Normally I don’t engage in these kind of false comparisons and I do know that south east asia has a problem with off shore industrial slavery unprecedented in the USA. Sometimes things are uniquely bad in other parts of the world and there is no domestic comparison. That is certainly the case with the enslaved fishing vessels (although a case can be made about EU/EFTA operated fishing vessels out of Western Sahara and Mauritania). But now I’m gonna make an exception and point to the Hard Rock building collapse in New Orleans in 2019 which killed 3 workers and injured dozens more[1]. Things like that happen all the time in the US as well. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1031_Canal#Partial_collapse_during_construction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1031_Canal#Partial_collapse_du...
  - jjeaff 6y ago

Err here in the United States you have people pissing in bottles and bags because they can't take a break without missing targets. The West is not immune to predatory hiring and employment practices.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

peteretep 6y ago

I have pissed in a bottle before out of expediency, but I've never spent several years stranded on a ship without power, company, etc, out of free will. Conflating the two seems weird.

Klinky 6y ago
Do you piss in a bottle on a daily basis as part of your job? Comparing peeing in a bottle [a few times in your life] for expediency compared to doing it on the daily, seems to be its own conflation.
- peteretep 6y ago
  If my current workplace offered me a 15% raise in exchange for forgoing toilet breaks and pissing in a bottle for the next year, I would go for it. I'm sure there's a number for which I'd agree to be stranded on a boat off the coast of Egypt without power, but I suspect it's closer to 15x my salary. As I understand it, this makes the latter 100x worse than the former.
  - Klinky 6y ago
    No, you'd need to compare the actual job that requires you to piss in a bottle, along with its salary, not your current job with a 15% bonus tacked on. Also people don't sign up to be abandoned on a ship, they're not told of that possibility, until it happens. They signed up to be merchant marines or seaman, not prisoners of ghost ships. Just because you find getting bit by a dog more palatable than falling into a pit of snakes, doesn't make getting bit by a dog okay or acceptable.
- unishark 6y ago
  Private investigators have to do this routinely. Of course they are probably self-employed. OSHA laws require companies allow bathroom breaks though.
- stickfigure 6y ago
  I piss in bottles and on the sides of roads on road trips. Sometimes daily, depending on the length of the trip. You make it sound like some great injustice. It's just pissing in a bottle, who cares? It's pretty offensive to compare this to being held prisoner on a ship.
  - dredmorbius 6y ago
    Doing something freely of choice with no (or very mimial) downside risk, and doing it at the penalty of losing ones jobs, whilst the employer denies the practice, have substantial daylight between them.
    - stickfigure 6y ago
      I can only assume you have some very deep seated issues around urine and urination? With a totally straight face, you're comparing pissing in bottles with being imprisoned for four years. Amazon could demand full bottles at close of workday, and then pour it on your head, and this comparison would still be farcical. Recalibrate your outrage. I'm going to blow your mind: RV toilets are just giant bottles with levers and valves.
      - dredmorbius 6y ago
        I am comparing the case of urinating on a roadtrip as a means to save a few minutes on arrival time, with a significant labour force being obligated to do so under terms and conditions of employment whilst their employer loudly and publicly denies this fact. (The fact that the employer later retracted the denail doesn't obviate the predicate clause.) Your reading of my statement is far from the mark, curiously so.
      - Klinky 6y ago
        Please start peeing in bottles daily as part of your job, and let your co-workers know about, note their reaction. This discussion is about unacceptable work hazards, not exclusively about being imprisoned on a ship.

unreal37 6y ago

It seems fairly easy to get a union if a workplace wants one...

Ar-Curunir 6y ago
Right, ask Amazon workers about that.
- fennecfoxen 6y ago
  The warehouse workers down in Alabama? Why would you ask them? They didn't want one. It wasn't close at all, either.
  - Ar-Curunir 6y ago
    Because Amazon moving killed all other local work opportunities, and also because Amazon did not allow workers access to union organizers and information. The case is probably going to go the NRLB which will rule the election illegal.
    - fennecfoxen 6y ago
      It wasn't a close thing. It was a blowout, substantially worse than 2-to-1 against. (1,798—738). Maybe you're right, and there will be lawsuits. That's a far cry from saying that the workers there wanted a union.
- unreal37 6y ago
  That's my point. They did ask them, and they said no.

open0 6y ago

Ever been enslaved on a Thai fishing boat? I know a few people who have, including a neighbor that was missing for 3 years. The US has its own problems, but places like Dubai, Southeast Asia, etc. have a much more severe problem with mistreatment and abuse of workers. Last year a building collapsed here during construction and killed about 60 people. Stuff like that happens all the time.

Ar-Curunir 6y ago
I lived in Gulf countries for 12 years; I'm well aware of the shitty and life-threatening work conditions for migrant labourers. I've also lived in the US for 9 years; I'm also well aware of the mistreatment of workers here, such as workers who are undocumented migrants, workers who are prisoners, workers who work gig companies, Amazon workers, and many others.
- tacocataco 6y ago
  The common theme here is humans are excellent at externalizing costs. Jeff bezos is not pissing in a bottle. The people who profit the most from these ships are never trapped on them.
runarberg 6y ago
Normally I don’t engage in these kind of false comparisons and I do know that south east asia has a problem with off shore industrial slavery unprecedented in the USA. Sometimes things are uniquely bad in other parts of the world and there is no domestic comparison. That is certainly the case with the enslaved fishing vessels (although a case can be made about EU/EFTA operated fishing vessels out of Western Sahara and Mauritania). But now I’m gonna make an exception and point to the Hard Rock building collapse in New Orleans in 2019 which killed 3 workers and injured dozens more[1]. Things like that happen all the time in the US as well. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1031_Canal#Partial_collapse_during_construction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1031_Canal#Partial_collapse_du...
- jjeaff 6y ago