8 ms·

Put macOS on the iPad, You Cowards

59 points by paulpan 5y ago

ilrwbwrkhv 5y ago
I hope they don't. The intent of these devices are different.
Spartan-S63 5y ago
No, don't. The intent of the device is different and the primary method of input is different. Adding a touch control to a predominately pointer-based UI is an awful experience. Using the iPad as a Sidecar display is nice for when you need the pencil but using it as a touchscreen is pretty awful. It really shows that macOS shouldn't be accessed via that method. Rather, Apple should take a big leap forward with iPadOS 15 and allow more powerful apps to run on it, such as Xcode et al. Sure, it opens up the ecosystem a little and lowers the walls of the garden, _for iPadOS_, but it keeps the same best-in-class experience as iOS while bringing the power of macOS "pro" apps.
- PurpleFoxy 5y ago
  Some people want to use the iPad with a keyboard, mouse and external monitor. The iPad supports these things so why not let those users run full programs.
MrFoof 5y ago
We should see some changes to iPad OS come WWDC on June 7th. Maybe nothing amazing, but here's hoping. Meanwhile you can order an iPad next week with the same CPU (presumably clocked lower), GPU, memory and storage as the iMac also announced on Tuesday.
ch_123 5y ago
While the Magic keyboard provides a viable keyboard and mouse setup for the iPad, I would much rather see macOS-style features made available on the iPad - particularly a Unix shell and the standard tools which go with that.
- pjmlp 5y ago
  Mac OS did just fine without them until System 8, and the fact that it has one is just a side effect from NeXT acquisition.
  - GekkePrutser 5y ago
    macOS isn't really comparable to what it was in those days, nor is the environment around. In our company I see a lot of web developers favouring Mac because they have a Linux-style commandline available. And console applications like vim are becoming more popular again. I wouldn't see these guys working on an iPad though, however if an iPad would become a dockable macOS laptop I would.
    - pjmlp 5y ago
      Those guys would do better sponsoring Linux friendly OEMs, as they might be surprised when Apple only catters to iOS and macOS developers. Console applications being trendy is more about nostalgia stuff than anything else. I have been there where TUI was the best one could hope for and don't miss it for one second. Any language can be used for automation and most modern environment support REPLs anyway. As for vim, better watch out for VSCode and Sublime.
      - GekkePrutser 5y ago
        The problem with Linux is manageability. We can't manage Linux as strictly as our security department wants. Well, we could, but it would mean mandating a certain distro and highly customising this, removing root rights and tightly locking stuff down with SELinux etc. The developers have no interest in this and neither do I to manage it. Too many awkward edge cases. They can use Linux but they're banned from the network. And "Just install whatever you like and configure it however you want" will just not work if they want it on the network. I know, old-style traditional IT mentality but this is what we're stuck with. The word of digital security is the law here. I have to work within their rules. Apple has good MDM management APIs that can't be overridden even by admin users, good hardware and the devs are mostly happy with it. Locked-down Linux is worse than locked-down Mac. It's a tradeoff for all of us.
coldtea 5y ago
The allure of the iPad is that it's not macOS. It opens instantly, apps can't screw the system up ever (at worst you delete the app and re-install it), everything is neatly sandboxed, the UI is optimized for touch, etc. And iPad with macOS would be unusable as a tablet with regular mac apps (macOS requires more precision control and has smaller targets), and at best would be a way to get a Mac to hook to a monitor and use with a mouse and keyboard. But you can already get a Mini for half the price, or an Air that also comes with a keyboard. So what exactly do you gain? Especially if they also come up with a M1 Macbook (no Air/Pro, the small version). What Apple could do however, is further improve iPad OS multitasking and windowing use to make it better for multi-app workflows. Already basic multitasking, window-tiling, drag and drop, and file Finder support, and USB-C have improved it dramatically for such purposes. That said, Final Cut Pro, Logic, XCode and a Terminal would be nice additions...
- luke2m 5y ago
  Maybe an ipad subsystem for macOS/Linux for advanced users? Or opening Virtual Machine support?
  - EricE 5y ago
    RE your subsystem idea - you can run iOS/iPad OS apps on the new Apple Silicon Mac's today (as long as developers allow it).
- EricE 5y ago
  >So what exactly do you gain? Especially if they also come up with a M1 Macbook (no Air/Pro, the small version) Fluidity of not having to carry or manage two devices would be the main attraction for me. M1 Mac's can already run iOS and iPad OS apps so there is no need for a dual boot mode. When I want the pure tablet experience I just stick to native iPad OS apps. When I need more power and flexibility, hook up a keyboard and track pad and now I can use MacOS apps effectively. Heck if they actually paid a smidgen of attention to Mission Control it could easily provide the functionality to manage the different "modes" - at the minimum a macOS workspace vs. an iPad OS workspace. The bits are there; are they motivated to do it? Probably not but it's still nice to dream about what it could be :p
robenkleene 5y ago
While I'm one of the people that wants macOS on iPadOS, the sentiment that "maybe Apple doesn't realize there's a market for macOS in an iPad form factor" is silly. The iPad is a play for innovators dilemma-style disruption from the bottom, and that possibility diminishes if you allow macOS on iPads. The reason the full Photoshop can't run on iPadOS is because iOS doesn't allow that kind of software to run. It only allows "democratized" software (the bottom) that's easy to run, install, and uninstall, and won't interfere with battery, etc... It's a different software model than we use on macOS. It's better on some ways, but it's clearly worse in others. Apple is still betting that there's value in this alternative software model, and it's so consistent with Apple's modus operandi of control, that I'm willing to bet they'll take this battle to their grave (you'll never get an unlocked iPad, ever). I think a more fruitful approach with Apple is pushing them to innovate more with macOS and the Mac. Tell them to make more exciting hardware, stop having their laptops designed by the industrial-engineering B-team. Stop porting iOS-paradigm OS features that don't make sense on the Mac. Instead create more real innovative desktop-class features like Exposé. You can also keep promoting this iPadOS thing at the same time. But sorry Apple, you're never going to transition the content creators to iPadOS. It's just not going to happen ever because the computing model just doesn't work for that kind of work. The best bet is to get back to working hard on the Mac and macOS.
- paulpan 5y ago
  Agreed, Apple wants to avoid Microsoft's failure with trying to splinter a desktop-oriented OS for all form factors. I tried to like Windows 8 but found it too confusing and frustrating to use. While we might all like the idea of device convergence, the technology is not fully there yet. The new iPad Pro with M1 could be a sign of the future but Apple recognizes that adoption needs to be deliberate and slow - especially when there's millions of users at stake. Ideally I'd like to see a "desktop mode" akin to the Samsung DeX announced at the upcoming WWDC. This would allow users to use their iPads as desktop replacements in a truer sense, together with keyboard, mice and an external monitor.
wayneftw 5y ago
Imagine if iPadOS turned into macOS when you plugged in a keyboard and mouse, then back into iPadOS when unplugged. That would be awesome! To the naysayers: Is the intent of a display different than that of another display? What could possibly be wrong with treating an iPad as just a display?? Isn't that the holy grail? A mobile device that becomes a full PC when you sit at a desk.
- tinus_hn 5y ago
  The iPad is a media consumption device, with tight controls so you don’t have to spend your time managing a million settings and updates, worrying about security. You can’t flip from that to an open OS back and forth. If Apple ever went this way it would be by locking down MacOS, instead of opening up iPadOS.
  - EricE 5y ago
    The iPad has been far more than a media consumption device for a long time now. Two examples - the first is a whole community of people for whom the iPad is their primary or sole device: https://www.macstories.net/ipad/ https://www.macstories.net/ipad/ Second is Jason Snell, a LONG time Mac user, who prefers the iPad for editing audio for the many podcasts he is involved in: https://sixcolors.com/post/2015/11/editing-podcasts-on-ios-with-ferrite/ https://sixcolors.com/post/2015/11/editing-podcasts-on-ios-w... Noticed this isn't a recent phenomenon for either of those examples. Jason in particular still has Mac's in his overall production chain ( https://sixcolors.com/post/2019/11/why-my-ipad-podcast-workflow-still-includes-the-mac/ https://sixcolors.com/post/2019/11/why-my-ipad-podcast-workf... )since there are still many significant shortcomings in iPad OS - so being able to run macOS on iPad Pro hardware would absolutely have value to what I would would wager is a significant user community. Or Apple could just plug the many identified gaps in iPad OS. I won't be holding my breath for either to happen any time soon but I will welcome either if the day ever materializes.
lasftew 5y ago
As a happy owner of a Surface Pro, I tend to agree. Being able to have both a powerful laptop and a reading and media consumption device in one is great. While the iPad is a better tablet and (certainly the M1 powered) Macbook is arguably a better laptop, I still stay with the Surface. With Microsoft's nice recent improvements to WSL2 (GUI apps!), the development experience is mostly on par or even better than on MacOS, certainly if you workflows are mostly Linux based anyways. I find Windows is doing an ok job bridging between the touch and pointer worlds, so it's certainly not impossible for Apple to follow along.
2OEH8eoCRo0 5y ago
It's obvious that they don't want to disrupt their own cash cow monopoly app store.
pjmlp 5y ago
WWDC 2021 fortune teller, Catalist keeps improving, bringing even more iOS to macOS. Yet another set of Swift/Objective-C APIs get introduced without equivalent capabilities on POSIX.
Pulcinella 5y ago
If nothing else I would like a reverse-Catalyst for bringing AppKit apps to the iPad, even if it’s a program that has to be applied for. I want Sketch and XCode on the iPad. Especially for XCode, the iPad can already compile Swift code in the Swift Playgrounds app, so it’s technically feasible. Swift Playgrounds itself is just rough and buggy, at least last time I checked. (E.g. ARC reference counts don’t work how you would think because the playground seems to keep its own reference to your objects so objects don’t always deinitialize when they should. This is NOT a problem in XCode playgrounds in the Mac. I haven’t check Swift Playgrounds (a Catalyst port of the iPad app) on the Mac).
EricE 5y ago
I agree. I would love to have the iPad Pro hardware with macOS running on it. iPad OS is just far too restrictive with mulit-tasking, referring to multiple apps/windows at once and text selection/copy/paste - don't get me started. If you have the trackpad on the magic keyboard that would probably solve my issues with text selection; but the other core problems with iPad OS would still remain.
senthilnayagam 5y ago
dual boot would make lot of sense to me, willing to pay for this additional feature. I can then carry one device instead of two for my travel
- EricE 5y ago
  Don't even need to dual boot. M1 Macs run iPad OS and iOS apps along side macOS apps today. A little bit of polish with Mission Control would make switching between "iPad OS" and "macOS" modes fairly intuitive for some automation of say, adding a keyboard/trackpad to trigger full blown macOS mode and removing them triggering back to a Mission Control workspace that restores native iPad Pro look/fee. I don't think it would be much of a heavy lift, and from an overall user experience perspective not as fiddly or confusing as some obnoxious UI changes they made from the transition from iTunes to Apple Music, for example :p
boboche 5y ago
Had exactly the same reaction when I saw M1 in an ipad. What a missed opportunity to convert new people to MacOS with an incredible device. I would have skipped a surface for this. Dual booting would be nirvana but won’t happen as it would cannibalize their market. This looks like Porsche releasing a new car with an awesome engine, good looks, tons of drooling specs but you can’t drive it faster than 70mph. Shame but We’re probably not the intended target. Imagine how many surface sales this would have nuked though.
- dkonofalski 5y ago
  It's not a missed opportunity. It's a smart, intentional decision. Allowing MacOS apps to run on an iPad would be one thing but actually having them run MacOS (the desktop version) would not be a good idea without significant changes to the UI.
mikl 5y ago
The iPad is not a Mac. If you want macOS, get a Mac. iPadOS is much more user friendly to people who are not IT professionals. I’ve been moving less technically inclined family members to the iPad for this reason exactly. Having a full macOS on there would ruin that. Mac apps are not built for touch. The user experience of such a thing would be awful, and redesigning macOS to work on tablets would make it worse for Mac-users. So no, putting macOS on would not be brave. It would be dumb.
- PurpleFoxy 5y ago
  I need an iPad for drawing. I could use the iPad for everything if the software allowed it. Why make me buy 2 devices that do the same thing and have the same hardware?
  - mikl 5y ago
    > I need an iPad for drawing. Don’t confuse need with want. You have chosen to get an iPad to draw on, knowing the limitations of its touch-based OS. You could have gotten a Mac with a Wacom tablet or a Microsoft Surface instead, if you really wanted one machine for everything.
    - PurpleFoxy 5y ago
      Ok to reword. I’m going to get the iPad since it is the best value drawing tablet. I don’t need or want a MacBook. With some realistic changes apple could let me run full desktop apps on the iPad when I have it docked with a keyboard and mouse
easton 5y ago
(Forgive me if this sounds really dumb, I'm running on surface-level knowledge from doing a similar thing on Android a few years ago) Would it be possible to grab a filesystem from a arm64 installation of macOS and chroot into it from a jailbroken iPad, or are there too many kernel level differences to make that impossible (without breaking stuff)? chroot is shipped with macOS, so you should be able to do it from macOS->macOS.
filoeleven 5y ago
I’d settle for being able to change text size in iOS browsers per tab instead of it being a full-system change...you know, like how ALL desktop browsers work.
- williamstein 5y ago
  You can now change size in iOS browsers per website, similar to desktop browsers. Click the "aA" icon at the upper left of the address bar and you'll see "a 100% A". By clicking the left or right icons, you can change the size percentage. It's very similar to desktop browsers. This relatively new functionality is also very close to where the UI is for "Show Reader View", so it's easy to miss.
jareklupinski 5y ago
and obliterate an entire product line? too many people have been saying "I will stop buying Macbooks once the iPad runs macOS" too loudly for that to be a reality anymore :(
andrewrothman 5y ago
After thinking about this for a while, I think they've been making the right move. However, I'd like to see: - Xcode, Final Cut Pro, and other pro apps with full feature-sets designed specifically for iPad (touch, mouse, and keyboard) - A new keyboard accessory more like a laptop with a strong base like a Surface Book 3 - A revamped Terminal.app for Mac and iPad with rendering perf improvements like in iTerm2, Alacritty, and Kitty - Virtualization support, or at least something that somehow runs Linux containers - Advanced tiling window management... maybe only via keyboard shortcuts - Ability to script iPad OS behavior - window management and keyboard remapping - Ability to run unsigned CLI and GUI apps from inside a terminal and/or launched via other iOS apps like would be used in iOS Xcode Bonus: Unlockable bootloader to run alternative OS's like M1 Macs can. If they did all of these I'd strongly consider buying one as my primary device.
throwawaysea 5y ago
I want to be able to run and switch between iPad OS, MacOS, and alternatives like Linux. We need to legislate open hardware requirements.
- GekkePrutser 5y ago
  This would be great, yes. Just being able to choose how to use it.
mensetmanusman 5y ago
They could easily placate this by offering a ‘macos’ app that costs $100 on the app store that when pressed turns on m1-macos.
em-bee 5y ago
i am afraid the the reverse might be true, it's not that apple is afraid to put macos on the ipad, but that they would rather put ios on laptops. ios is way more locked down than macos is, and that's what apple really wants: more control. not less. so if they dared, they would do just the opposite of what the article is asking. android on laptops exists, and i believe chromebooks are similarly limited (i never used one, so i can't tell)
GekkePrutser 5y ago
I have to agree with this.. Or at least put a touchscreen on Macs :) I prefer the laptop form factor but not having a touchscreen is a weird omission.

59 points by paulpan 5y ago

I hope they don't. The intent of these devices are different.

No, don't. The intent of the device is different and the primary method of input is different. Adding a touch control to a predominately pointer-based UI is an awful experience. Using the iPad as a Sidecar display is nice for when you need the pencil but using it as a touchscreen is pretty awful. It really shows that macOS shouldn't be accessed via that method. Rather, Apple should take a big leap forward with iPadOS 15 and allow more powerful apps to run on it, such as Xcode et al. Sure, it opens up the ecosystem a little and lowers the walls of the garden, _for iPadOS_, but it keeps the same best-in-class experience as iOS while bringing the power of macOS "pro" apps.

PurpleFoxy 5y ago
Some people want to use the iPad with a keyboard, mouse and external monitor. The iPad supports these things so why not let those users run full programs.

MrFoof 5y ago

We should see some changes to iPad OS come WWDC on June 7th. Maybe nothing amazing, but here's hoping. Meanwhile you can order an iPad next week with the same CPU (presumably clocked lower), GPU, memory and storage as the iMac also announced on Tuesday.

ch_123 5y ago

While the Magic keyboard provides a viable keyboard and mouse setup for the iPad, I would much rather see macOS-style features made available on the iPad - particularly a Unix shell and the standard tools which go with that.

pjmlp 5y ago
Mac OS did just fine without them until System 8, and the fact that it has one is just a side effect from NeXT acquisition.
- GekkePrutser 5y ago
  macOS isn't really comparable to what it was in those days, nor is the environment around. In our company I see a lot of web developers favouring Mac because they have a Linux-style commandline available. And console applications like vim are becoming more popular again. I wouldn't see these guys working on an iPad though, however if an iPad would become a dockable macOS laptop I would.
  - pjmlp 5y ago
    Those guys would do better sponsoring Linux friendly OEMs, as they might be surprised when Apple only catters to iOS and macOS developers. Console applications being trendy is more about nostalgia stuff than anything else. I have been there where TUI was the best one could hope for and don't miss it for one second. Any language can be used for automation and most modern environment support REPLs anyway. As for vim, better watch out for VSCode and Sublime.
    - GekkePrutser 5y ago
      The problem with Linux is manageability. We can't manage Linux as strictly as our security department wants. Well, we could, but it would mean mandating a certain distro and highly customising this, removing root rights and tightly locking stuff down with SELinux etc. The developers have no interest in this and neither do I to manage it. Too many awkward edge cases. They can use Linux but they're banned from the network. And "Just install whatever you like and configure it however you want" will just not work if they want it on the network. I know, old-style traditional IT mentality but this is what we're stuck with. The word of digital security is the law here. I have to work within their rules. Apple has good MDM management APIs that can't be overridden even by admin users, good hardware and the devs are mostly happy with it. Locked-down Linux is worse than locked-down Mac. It's a tradeoff for all of us.

coldtea 5y ago

The allure of the iPad is that it's not macOS. It opens instantly, apps can't screw the system up ever (at worst you delete the app and re-install it), everything is neatly sandboxed, the UI is optimized for touch, etc. And iPad with macOS would be unusable as a tablet with regular mac apps (macOS requires more precision control and has smaller targets), and at best would be a way to get a Mac to hook to a monitor and use with a mouse and keyboard. But you can already get a Mini for half the price, or an Air that also comes with a keyboard. So what exactly do you gain? Especially if they also come up with a M1 Macbook (no Air/Pro, the small version). What Apple could do however, is further improve iPad OS multitasking and windowing use to make it better for multi-app workflows. Already basic multitasking, window-tiling, drag and drop, and file Finder support, and USB-C have improved it dramatically for such purposes. That said, Final Cut Pro, Logic, XCode and a Terminal would be nice additions...

luke2m 5y ago
Maybe an ipad subsystem for macOS/Linux for advanced users? Or opening Virtual Machine support?
- EricE 5y ago
  RE your subsystem idea - you can run iOS/iPad OS apps on the new Apple Silicon Mac's today (as long as developers allow it).
EricE 5y ago
>So what exactly do you gain? Especially if they also come up with a M1 Macbook (no Air/Pro, the small version) Fluidity of not having to carry or manage two devices would be the main attraction for me. M1 Mac's can already run iOS and iPad OS apps so there is no need for a dual boot mode. When I want the pure tablet experience I just stick to native iPad OS apps. When I need more power and flexibility, hook up a keyboard and track pad and now I can use MacOS apps effectively. Heck if they actually paid a smidgen of attention to Mission Control it could easily provide the functionality to manage the different "modes" - at the minimum a macOS workspace vs. an iPad OS workspace. The bits are there; are they motivated to do it? Probably not but it's still nice to dream about what it could be :p

robenkleene 5y ago

While I'm one of the people that wants macOS on iPadOS, the sentiment that "maybe Apple doesn't realize there's a market for macOS in an iPad form factor" is silly. The iPad is a play for innovators dilemma-style disruption from the bottom, and that possibility diminishes if you allow macOS on iPads. The reason the full Photoshop can't run on iPadOS is because iOS doesn't allow that kind of software to run. It only allows "democratized" software (the bottom) that's easy to run, install, and uninstall, and won't interfere with battery, etc... It's a different software model than we use on macOS. It's better on some ways, but it's clearly worse in others. Apple is still betting that there's value in this alternative software model, and it's so consistent with Apple's modus operandi of control, that I'm willing to bet they'll take this battle to their grave (you'll never get an unlocked iPad, ever). I think a more fruitful approach with Apple is pushing them to innovate more with macOS and the Mac. Tell them to make more exciting hardware, stop having their laptops designed by the industrial-engineering B-team. Stop porting iOS-paradigm OS features that don't make sense on the Mac. Instead create more real innovative desktop-class features like Exposé. You can also keep promoting this iPadOS thing at the same time. But sorry Apple, you're never going to transition the content creators to iPadOS. It's just not going to happen ever because the computing model just doesn't work for that kind of work. The best bet is to get back to working hard on the Mac and macOS.

paulpan 5y ago
Agreed, Apple wants to avoid Microsoft's failure with trying to splinter a desktop-oriented OS for all form factors. I tried to like Windows 8 but found it too confusing and frustrating to use. While we might all like the idea of device convergence, the technology is not fully there yet. The new iPad Pro with M1 could be a sign of the future but Apple recognizes that adoption needs to be deliberate and slow - especially when there's millions of users at stake. Ideally I'd like to see a "desktop mode" akin to the Samsung DeX announced at the upcoming WWDC. This would allow users to use their iPads as desktop replacements in a truer sense, together with keyboard, mice and an external monitor.

wayneftw 5y ago

Imagine if iPadOS turned into macOS when you plugged in a keyboard and mouse, then back into iPadOS when unplugged. That would be awesome! To the naysayers: Is the intent of a display different than that of another display? What could possibly be wrong with treating an iPad as just a display?? Isn't that the holy grail? A mobile device that becomes a full PC when you sit at a desk.

tinus_hn 5y ago
The iPad is a media consumption device, with tight controls so you don’t have to spend your time managing a million settings and updates, worrying about security. You can’t flip from that to an open OS back and forth. If Apple ever went this way it would be by locking down MacOS, instead of opening up iPadOS.
- EricE 5y ago
  The iPad has been far more than a media consumption device for a long time now. Two examples - the first is a whole community of people for whom the iPad is their primary or sole device: https://www.macstories.net/ipad/ https://www.macstories.net/ipad/ Second is Jason Snell, a LONG time Mac user, who prefers the iPad for editing audio for the many podcasts he is involved in: https://sixcolors.com/post/2015/11/editing-podcasts-on-ios-with-ferrite/ https://sixcolors.com/post/2015/11/editing-podcasts-on-ios-w... Noticed this isn't a recent phenomenon for either of those examples. Jason in particular still has Mac's in his overall production chain ( https://sixcolors.com/post/2019/11/why-my-ipad-podcast-workflow-still-includes-the-mac/ https://sixcolors.com/post/2019/11/why-my-ipad-podcast-workf... )since there are still many significant shortcomings in iPad OS - so being able to run macOS on iPad Pro hardware would absolutely have value to what I would would wager is a significant user community. Or Apple could just plug the many identified gaps in iPad OS. I won't be holding my breath for either to happen any time soon but I will welcome either if the day ever materializes.

lasftew 5y ago

As a happy owner of a Surface Pro, I tend to agree. Being able to have both a powerful laptop and a reading and media consumption device in one is great. While the iPad is a better tablet and (certainly the M1 powered) Macbook is arguably a better laptop, I still stay with the Surface. With Microsoft's nice recent improvements to WSL2 (GUI apps!), the development experience is mostly on par or even better than on MacOS, certainly if you workflows are mostly Linux based anyways. I find Windows is doing an ok job bridging between the touch and pointer worlds, so it's certainly not impossible for Apple to follow along.

2OEH8eoCRo0 5y ago

It's obvious that they don't want to disrupt their own cash cow monopoly app store.

pjmlp 5y ago

WWDC 2021 fortune teller, Catalist keeps improving, bringing even more iOS to macOS. Yet another set of Swift/Objective-C APIs get introduced without equivalent capabilities on POSIX.

Pulcinella 5y ago

If nothing else I would like a reverse-Catalyst for bringing AppKit apps to the iPad, even if it’s a program that has to be applied for. I want Sketch and XCode on the iPad. Especially for XCode, the iPad can already compile Swift code in the Swift Playgrounds app, so it’s technically feasible. Swift Playgrounds itself is just rough and buggy, at least last time I checked. (E.g. ARC reference counts don’t work how you would think because the playground seems to keep its own reference to your objects so objects don’t always deinitialize when they should. This is NOT a problem in XCode playgrounds in the Mac. I haven’t check Swift Playgrounds (a Catalyst port of the iPad app) on the Mac).

EricE 5y ago

I agree. I would love to have the iPad Pro hardware with macOS running on it. iPad OS is just far too restrictive with mulit-tasking, referring to multiple apps/windows at once and text selection/copy/paste - don't get me started. If you have the trackpad on the magic keyboard that would probably solve my issues with text selection; but the other core problems with iPad OS would still remain.

senthilnayagam 5y ago

dual boot would make lot of sense to me, willing to pay for this additional feature. I can then carry one device instead of two for my travel

EricE 5y ago
Don't even need to dual boot. M1 Macs run iPad OS and iOS apps along side macOS apps today. A little bit of polish with Mission Control would make switching between "iPad OS" and "macOS" modes fairly intuitive for some automation of say, adding a keyboard/trackpad to trigger full blown macOS mode and removing them triggering back to a Mission Control workspace that restores native iPad Pro look/fee. I don't think it would be much of a heavy lift, and from an overall user experience perspective not as fiddly or confusing as some obnoxious UI changes they made from the transition from iTunes to Apple Music, for example :p

boboche 5y ago

Had exactly the same reaction when I saw M1 in an ipad. What a missed opportunity to convert new people to MacOS with an incredible device. I would have skipped a surface for this. Dual booting would be nirvana but won’t happen as it would cannibalize their market. This looks like Porsche releasing a new car with an awesome engine, good looks, tons of drooling specs but you can’t drive it faster than 70mph. Shame but We’re probably not the intended target. Imagine how many surface sales this would have nuked though.

dkonofalski 5y ago
It's not a missed opportunity. It's a smart, intentional decision. Allowing MacOS apps to run on an iPad would be one thing but actually having them run MacOS (the desktop version) would not be a good idea without significant changes to the UI.

mikl 5y ago

The iPad is not a Mac. If you want macOS, get a Mac. iPadOS is much more user friendly to people who are not IT professionals. I’ve been moving less technically inclined family members to the iPad for this reason exactly. Having a full macOS on there would ruin that. Mac apps are not built for touch. The user experience of such a thing would be awful, and redesigning macOS to work on tablets would make it worse for Mac-users. So no, putting macOS on would not be brave. It would be dumb.

PurpleFoxy 5y ago
I need an iPad for drawing. I could use the iPad for everything if the software allowed it. Why make me buy 2 devices that do the same thing and have the same hardware?
- mikl 5y ago
  > I need an iPad for drawing. Don’t confuse need with want. You have chosen to get an iPad to draw on, knowing the limitations of its touch-based OS. You could have gotten a Mac with a Wacom tablet or a Microsoft Surface instead, if you really wanted one machine for everything.
  - PurpleFoxy 5y ago
    Ok to reword. I’m going to get the iPad since it is the best value drawing tablet. I don’t need or want a MacBook. With some realistic changes apple could let me run full desktop apps on the iPad when I have it docked with a keyboard and mouse

easton 5y ago

(Forgive me if this sounds really dumb, I'm running on surface-level knowledge from doing a similar thing on Android a few years ago) Would it be possible to grab a filesystem from a arm64 installation of macOS and chroot into it from a jailbroken iPad, or are there too many kernel level differences to make that impossible (without breaking stuff)? chroot is shipped with macOS, so you should be able to do it from macOS->macOS.

filoeleven 5y ago

I’d settle for being able to change text size in iOS browsers per tab instead of it being a full-system change...you know, like how ALL desktop browsers work.

williamstein 5y ago
You can now change size in iOS browsers per website, similar to desktop browsers. Click the "aA" icon at the upper left of the address bar and you'll see "a 100% A". By clicking the left or right icons, you can change the size percentage. It's very similar to desktop browsers. This relatively new functionality is also very close to where the UI is for "Show Reader View", so it's easy to miss.

jareklupinski 5y ago

and obliterate an entire product line? too many people have been saying "I will stop buying Macbooks once the iPad runs macOS" too loudly for that to be a reality anymore :(

andrewrothman 5y ago

After thinking about this for a while, I think they've been making the right move. However, I'd like to see: - Xcode, Final Cut Pro, and other pro apps with full feature-sets designed specifically for iPad (touch, mouse, and keyboard) - A new keyboard accessory more like a laptop with a strong base like a Surface Book 3 - A revamped Terminal.app for Mac and iPad with rendering perf improvements like in iTerm2, Alacritty, and Kitty - Virtualization support, or at least something that somehow runs Linux containers - Advanced tiling window management... maybe only via keyboard shortcuts - Ability to script iPad OS behavior - window management and keyboard remapping - Ability to run unsigned CLI and GUI apps from inside a terminal and/or launched via other iOS apps like would be used in iOS Xcode Bonus: Unlockable bootloader to run alternative OS's like M1 Macs can. If they did all of these I'd strongly consider buying one as my primary device.

throwawaysea 5y ago

I want to be able to run and switch between iPad OS, MacOS, and alternatives like Linux. We need to legislate open hardware requirements.

GekkePrutser 5y ago
This would be great, yes. Just being able to choose how to use it.

mensetmanusman 5y ago

They could easily placate this by offering a ‘macos’ app that costs $100 on the app store that when pressed turns on m1-macos.

em-bee 5y ago

i am afraid the the reverse might be true, it's not that apple is afraid to put macos on the ipad, but that they would rather put ios on laptops. ios is way more locked down than macos is, and that's what apple really wants: more control. not less. so if they dared, they would do just the opposite of what the article is asking. android on laptops exists, and i believe chromebooks are similarly limited (i never used one, so i can't tell)

GekkePrutser 5y ago

I have to agree with this.. Or at least put a touchscreen on Macs :) I prefer the laptop form factor but not having a touchscreen is a weird omission.