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We should pass a law that all ICE vehicles must get less than 5 miles per gallon. That will make people need more gas, and it might accelerate the adoption of

We should pass a law that all ICE vehicles must get less than 5 miles per gallon. That will make people need more gas, and it might accelerate the adoption of electric vehicles!! What a horseshit argument. So bad that I have a very different sentiment towards Square as a company now.

celticninja 5y ago
Well cheap gas in the US has contributed to vehicles not improving their efficency. And I would hazard that US automobiles have caused more environmental damage in their lifetime than bitcoin has. Are you pushing for better public transport infrastructure in the USA? Or are you thinking about a new/second car to get around?
- k2enemy 5y ago
  I'm pointing out that increasing demand for something "bad" is a stupid way to make it expensive. Use pigovian taxes or something else that doesn't destroy the environment. If we want to quicken the adoption of clean electricity, then tax dirty electricity.
  - celticninja 5y ago
    No issues with that, but surely tax gas by that same reasoning. My point is that fuel for vehicles is bad for the environment, we know that, yet gas in the US is very cheap and as a result there is no push for public transport which is cleaner and more efficient. So for every post about how bad bitcoin is, it misses the point that there are older technologies, which are replaceable with cheaper, cleaner and more efficient alternatives now. But these are glossed over because bitcoin is the current target. If bitcoin dissappeared tomorrow i am sure that 90% of people who published an article about how bad it was would not switch to the next polluter. They would happily return to their status quo. Its disingenuous basically.
rogerth1s 5y ago
you don't understand how electric markets work. electricity is bid on daily, based on marginal cost of production. solar has a very low marginal cost which pushes down the cost curve. the more solar energy there is --> cheaper price to consumers. however, utilities struggle with having a lot of solar/wind generation as there is a timing mismatch between peak generation and peak demand. bitcoin can be used like a sponge to sop up excess production and allow currently stalled projects to proceed without the need for additional new load.

celticninja 5y ago

Well cheap gas in the US has contributed to vehicles not improving their efficency. And I would hazard that US automobiles have caused more environmental damage in their lifetime than bitcoin has. Are you pushing for better public transport infrastructure in the USA? Or are you thinking about a new/second car to get around?

k2enemy 5y ago
I'm pointing out that increasing demand for something "bad" is a stupid way to make it expensive. Use pigovian taxes or something else that doesn't destroy the environment. If we want to quicken the adoption of clean electricity, then tax dirty electricity.
- celticninja 5y ago
  No issues with that, but surely tax gas by that same reasoning. My point is that fuel for vehicles is bad for the environment, we know that, yet gas in the US is very cheap and as a result there is no push for public transport which is cleaner and more efficient. So for every post about how bad bitcoin is, it misses the point that there are older technologies, which are replaceable with cheaper, cleaner and more efficient alternatives now. But these are glossed over because bitcoin is the current target. If bitcoin dissappeared tomorrow i am sure that 90% of people who published an article about how bad it was would not switch to the next polluter. They would happily return to their status quo. Its disingenuous basically.

rogerth1s 5y ago

you don't understand how electric markets work. electricity is bid on daily, based on marginal cost of production. solar has a very low marginal cost which pushes down the cost curve. the more solar energy there is --> cheaper price to consumers. however, utilities struggle with having a lot of solar/wind generation as there is a timing mismatch between peak generation and peak demand. bitcoin can be used like a sponge to sop up excess production and allow currently stalled projects to proceed without the need for additional new load.