7 ms·

Walter Mondale Has Died

28 points by da_big_ghey 5y ago

xwdv 5y ago
I never really understood why he lost so badly to Reagan.
- gedy 5y ago
  Reagan was very popular, the US was on an upswing, and Mondale came across with a very wooden personality. The message seemed more positive from Reagan.
  - baldfat 5y ago
    We were still in a HUGE recession when Regan took over and had a period of inflation and mortgages had an interest rate of 12% and higher. This was more a reflection on how badly things went under Carter and not about Mondale. Mondale should have never been the candidate.
- boulos 5y ago
  The argument is roughly "incumbent, economy, sexism" in that order. When things have recently trended positively (particularly with the economy), as they did in 1984, the incumbent almost always wins in the US. On Sexism, Mondale chose Ferraro as his running mate (the first major party ticket with a woman!). This wasn't received well overall: "only 22% of women were pleased about her selection, versus 18% who agreed that it was a bad idea. 60% of all voters thought that pressure from women's groups had led to Mondale's decision, versus 22% who believed that he had chosen the best available candidate." [1]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1984_United_States_presidential_election#Campaign https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1984_United_States_presidentia...
  - happytoexplain 5y ago
    > 60% of all voters thought that pressure from women's groups had led to Mondale's decision, versus 22% who believed that he had chosen the best available candidate I'd imagine some people felt that both statements were true. Measuring opinion is an interesting challenge.
  - AdamJacobMuller 5y ago
    All of that explains why he lost, but perhaps, not why he lost SO BADLY. He only won his home state of Minnesota and only did so by .18% (<4000 votes)!!! It really was an amazingly epic blowout.
    - ansible 5y ago
      Yes. Note that Al Gore lost his home state of Tennessee in his 2000 bid for the presidency. If Gore had won TN, Florida wouldn't have mattered as much.
  - tablespoon 5y ago
    > The argument is roughly "incumbent, economy, sexism" in that order. Also personality? I wasn't even alive during that election, but I've seen videos of Reagan's (quite good) jokes during those debates. I've never seen anything from Mondale, so it's likely that he didn't leave nearly as good of an impression.
- StevePerkins 5y ago
  During the general campaign, he openly vowed to raise taxes. Even in the Democratic primaries, in 2020, Elizabeth Warren went from front-runner to done the moment she awkwardly acknowledged that taxes would go up under her health plan. So in a general election, in the 1980's? Forget it. Americans do NOT want to pay for anything themselves. Not then, not now. Even America's version of a left only believes that taxes should go up for other people, not themselves.
  - seibelj 5y ago
    Most people don’t know this, but 46% of all households pay zero income tax. https://www.statista.com/statistics/242138/percentages-of-us-households-that-pay-no-income-tax-by-income-level/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/242138/percentages-of-us... I think if we actually made everyone pay taxes, as more-socialist countries in the EU do that the American left raves about, there would be a lot less support for raising taxes. Right now “taxing the rich” is easy because so few people pay any taxes!
    - nonameiguess 5y ago
      "Most people" don't know this? It was the centerpiece of Mitt Romney's last presidential campaign and one of the most popular conservative media ecosystem talking points for years. It's hardly a secret. Also extremely misleading since labor income is only one taxable transaction among many that most people take part in, this doesn't account for state income tax, and it also doesn't account for FICA tax, which is federal and still based on labor income.
    - TylerE 5y ago
      Highly misleading since they still pay social security tax, and Medicare tax. Those alone are almost 10% (and that's not even touching sales tax, property tax, etc)
      - singlow 5y ago
        But to be fair, those aren't the taxes that get raised when one raises taxes. They raise the portion that is effectively zeroed out for a large portion of households who don't earn above the cutoff for the first tax bracket after deductions.
boulos 5y ago
RIP. I will admit that my first reaction was "Walter Mondale was still alive?". 93 years is a pretty good run!
- TylerE 5y ago
  Henry Kissinger is still alive (and giving terrible "advice" to conservative politicians).
  - boulos 5y ago
    I think more amusingly for this audience is his involvement with Theranos via George Schultz (who died in February).
  - 1cvmask 5y ago
    What do you mean by “conservative” politicians? The first President (after Nixon era) to resuscitate Kissinger was Bill Clinton: “Bill Clinton, embraced Kissinger, which began Kissinger’s apotheosis into his current incarnation as a bipartisan elder statesman, invoked by politicians who want to appear “serious.”” From: https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/henry-kissinger-hillary-clintons-tutor-in-war-and-peace/ https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/henry-kissinger-hi... —- Obama Era He was an advisor to Hillary Clinton was Secretary of State in the Obama administration and was instrumental in shaping policies like Honduras, Syria, Libya etc.. “The two former secretaries of state have been close for years, with Clinton calling him "a friend" and noting that she "relied on his counsel" when she was secretary of state from 2009 to 2013.” From: https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/hillary-henry-clintons-relationship-kissinger/story?id=39195203 https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/hillary-henry-clintons-relat...
  - baldfat 5y ago
    You made a mistake and think the present party system was the same back than. Nixon actually presented a Health Care Plan Nixon's Words “Without adequate health care, no one can make full use of his or her talents and opportunities. It is thus just as important that economic, racial and social barriers not stand in the way of good health care as it is to eliminate those barriers to a good education and a good job.” https://www.nixonfoundation.org/2015/11/the-nixon-comprehensive-health-insurance-plan/ https://www.nixonfoundation.org/2015/11/the-nixon-comprehens...
fieryskiff11 5y ago
never heard of her

28 points by da_big_ghey 5y ago

xwdv 5y ago

I never really understood why he lost so badly to Reagan.

gedy 5y ago
Reagan was very popular, the US was on an upswing, and Mondale came across with a very wooden personality. The message seemed more positive from Reagan.
- baldfat 5y ago
  We were still in a HUGE recession when Regan took over and had a period of inflation and mortgages had an interest rate of 12% and higher. This was more a reflection on how badly things went under Carter and not about Mondale. Mondale should have never been the candidate.
boulos 5y ago
The argument is roughly "incumbent, economy, sexism" in that order. When things have recently trended positively (particularly with the economy), as they did in 1984, the incumbent almost always wins in the US. On Sexism, Mondale chose Ferraro as his running mate (the first major party ticket with a woman!). This wasn't received well overall: "only 22% of women were pleased about her selection, versus 18% who agreed that it was a bad idea. 60% of all voters thought that pressure from women's groups had led to Mondale's decision, versus 22% who believed that he had chosen the best available candidate." [1]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1984_United_States_presidential_election#Campaign https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1984_United_States_presidentia...
- happytoexplain 5y ago
  > 60% of all voters thought that pressure from women's groups had led to Mondale's decision, versus 22% who believed that he had chosen the best available candidate I'd imagine some people felt that both statements were true. Measuring opinion is an interesting challenge.
- AdamJacobMuller 5y ago
  All of that explains why he lost, but perhaps, not why he lost SO BADLY. He only won his home state of Minnesota and only did so by .18% (<4000 votes)!!! It really was an amazingly epic blowout.
  - ansible 5y ago
    Yes. Note that Al Gore lost his home state of Tennessee in his 2000 bid for the presidency. If Gore had won TN, Florida wouldn't have mattered as much.
- tablespoon 5y ago
  > The argument is roughly "incumbent, economy, sexism" in that order. Also personality? I wasn't even alive during that election, but I've seen videos of Reagan's (quite good) jokes during those debates. I've never seen anything from Mondale, so it's likely that he didn't leave nearly as good of an impression.
StevePerkins 5y ago
During the general campaign, he openly vowed to raise taxes. Even in the Democratic primaries, in 2020, Elizabeth Warren went from front-runner to done the moment she awkwardly acknowledged that taxes would go up under her health plan. So in a general election, in the 1980's? Forget it. Americans do NOT want to pay for anything themselves. Not then, not now. Even America's version of a left only believes that taxes should go up for other people, not themselves.
- seibelj 5y ago
  Most people don’t know this, but 46% of all households pay zero income tax. https://www.statista.com/statistics/242138/percentages-of-us-households-that-pay-no-income-tax-by-income-level/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/242138/percentages-of-us... I think if we actually made everyone pay taxes, as more-socialist countries in the EU do that the American left raves about, there would be a lot less support for raising taxes. Right now “taxing the rich” is easy because so few people pay any taxes!
  - nonameiguess 5y ago
    "Most people" don't know this? It was the centerpiece of Mitt Romney's last presidential campaign and one of the most popular conservative media ecosystem talking points for years. It's hardly a secret. Also extremely misleading since labor income is only one taxable transaction among many that most people take part in, this doesn't account for state income tax, and it also doesn't account for FICA tax, which is federal and still based on labor income.
  - TylerE 5y ago
    Highly misleading since they still pay social security tax, and Medicare tax. Those alone are almost 10% (and that's not even touching sales tax, property tax, etc)
    - singlow 5y ago
      But to be fair, those aren't the taxes that get raised when one raises taxes. They raise the portion that is effectively zeroed out for a large portion of households who don't earn above the cutoff for the first tax bracket after deductions.

boulos 5y ago

RIP. I will admit that my first reaction was "Walter Mondale was still alive?". 93 years is a pretty good run!

TylerE 5y ago
Henry Kissinger is still alive (and giving terrible "advice" to conservative politicians).
- boulos 5y ago
  I think more amusingly for this audience is his involvement with Theranos via George Schultz (who died in February).
- 1cvmask 5y ago
  What do you mean by “conservative” politicians? The first President (after Nixon era) to resuscitate Kissinger was Bill Clinton: “Bill Clinton, embraced Kissinger, which began Kissinger’s apotheosis into his current incarnation as a bipartisan elder statesman, invoked by politicians who want to appear “serious.”” From: https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/henry-kissinger-hillary-clintons-tutor-in-war-and-peace/ https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/henry-kissinger-hi... —- Obama Era He was an advisor to Hillary Clinton was Secretary of State in the Obama administration and was instrumental in shaping policies like Honduras, Syria, Libya etc.. “The two former secretaries of state have been close for years, with Clinton calling him "a friend" and noting that she "relied on his counsel" when she was secretary of state from 2009 to 2013.” From: https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/hillary-henry-clintons-relationship-kissinger/story?id=39195203 https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/hillary-henry-clintons-relat...
- baldfat 5y ago
  You made a mistake and think the present party system was the same back than. Nixon actually presented a Health Care Plan Nixon's Words “Without adequate health care, no one can make full use of his or her talents and opportunities. It is thus just as important that economic, racial and social barriers not stand in the way of good health care as it is to eliminate those barriers to a good education and a good job.” https://www.nixonfoundation.org/2015/11/the-nixon-comprehensive-health-insurance-plan/ https://www.nixonfoundation.org/2015/11/the-nixon-comprehens...

fieryskiff11 5y ago

never heard of her