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>I think the people we should have compassion for are the people who are trying to do things the right way but running into headaches. Those are the people we s

by phillmv 15y ago

>I think the people we should have compassion for are the people who are trying to do things the right way but running into headaches. Those are the people we should make things easier for, not the people who are willing to break the law to get what they want. >I don't understand why it's so controversial among the pro-immigration crowd to say that people shouldn't come here illegally. It's because the official green card process is [utterly ridiculous](http://reason.com/archives/2008/10/01/what-part-of-legal-immigration http://reason.com/archives/2008/10/01/what-part-of-legal-imm...) and stacked against almost every prospective immigrant. It's one of those cases where the law has failed to catch up to the underlying economics of the situation: immigrants need jobs and the US has a need for cheap or highly specialized labour. That is the process that needs to be reformed. Kicking out the people who are already in the country doesn't achieve anything other than waste more money and ruin more lives.

fastfinner 15y ago
"Kicking out the people who are already in the country doesn't achieve anything other than waste more money and ruin more lives." It achieves fairness about who gets in. Rules may need to be revised, etc. No arguments here. But while the revision is taking place or not taking place the rules need to be followed.
- kelnos 15y ago
  If life were fair we'd all be living in luxury and wouldn't have to worry about this immigration crap. But life isn't fair. Laws aren't always fair. What inherent rule of the universe states that breaking an unfair law is wrong? Sure, you risk getting punished if you're caught. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't try, and that doesn't mean I'm not going to be sympathetic if I happen to agree with your point of view, and wish that there can be an outcome where you don't get punished. What positive benefit would come about due to kicking Vargas out of the country? Those on his side will just be angry, and the xenophobes will just remain as they are, satisfied that they ruined a life.
- phillmv 15y ago
  Well, no, this is assuming the problem gets fixed and most of the undocumented people living in the US suddenly become eligible. If a rule is unjust to begin with, I don't see how being fair in its application is all that paramount. Insert any number of parallels to the War on Drugs here.

by phillmv 15y ago

fastfinner 15y ago

"Kicking out the people who are already in the country doesn't achieve anything other than waste more money and ruin more lives." It achieves fairness about who gets in. Rules may need to be revised, etc. No arguments here. But while the revision is taking place or not taking place the rules need to be followed.

kelnos 15y ago
If life were fair we'd all be living in luxury and wouldn't have to worry about this immigration crap. But life isn't fair. Laws aren't always fair. What inherent rule of the universe states that breaking an unfair law is wrong? Sure, you risk getting punished if you're caught. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't try, and that doesn't mean I'm not going to be sympathetic if I happen to agree with your point of view, and wish that there can be an outcome where you don't get punished. What positive benefit would come about due to kicking Vargas out of the country? Those on his side will just be angry, and the xenophobes will just remain as they are, satisfied that they ruined a life.
phillmv 15y ago
Well, no, this is assuming the problem gets fixed and most of the undocumented people living in the US suddenly become eligible. If a rule is unjust to begin with, I don't see how being fair in its application is all that paramount. Insert any number of parallels to the War on Drugs here.