5 ms·

Such a sad situation. In addition, treadmills are many times more abusive to your joints that most other machines. Running fast on this at any weight of your bo

Such a sad situation. In addition, treadmills are many times more abusive to your joints that most other machines. Running fast on this at any weight of your body is like punching your joints with 80 pounds gloves. In 40 years you gonna see people walk with canes you will be moslty right if you assume they been heavy treadmill users. If you want to stay in shape and lose weight, climbers are heaven comparing to treadmills. On a climber you can set low speed and because you support yourself with hands, your legs joint are not as heavily abused as on treadmill. Do and hour on the lowest speed and I guarantee you lose bunch of weight and also will stay in shape heart wise. Nobody does slow speed on treadmill. Thats boring. But also average climber is some $15,000 comparing it to much simpler design of a belt and two rolls aka treadmill. That’s why Peleton has chosen them. btw treadmills were banned as cruel and inhumane by 1900.

fennecfoxen 6y ago
Weren't 19th-century treadmills basically the climbing machines you've been praising? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penal_treadmill https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penal_treadmill
galangalalgol 6y ago
Row machines are my favorite. Only cardio machine that gets me out of breath faster than running. Deadlifting is probably faster. Large muscle groups taken to the limit need lots of O2. Nothing works calves as well as mid-foot running though. Maybe a bicycle?
- giardini 6y ago
  I have never run out of breath on a rowing machine - not even close. It seems like a good exercise, don't get me wrong, but I can row and (talk, sing or whistle) at the same time with no problem. I set the "fan" on the highest level and row for 30 minutes at a time. I could row harder but I fear breaking the bicycle chain at the core of the machine. I could row longer but it really is boring. But I have never met anyone else who rows like I do. The rowing machine quickly exhausts some individuals whom appear to be in outstanding health. I always wrote it off to their being out of shape, reformed smokers, recovery from illness, etc. But if you're normal then I may be somewhat unusual in my cardiovascular capacity.
  - cycomanic 6y ago
    I suspect you are simply rowing without proper resistance, it's similar to how you can ride a bike by simply barely resting your feet on the pedals. Rowing machines generally work you out very well, because they engage so many muscle groups and the same time, thus requiring a lot of oxygen being delivered to them. In fact rowers typically have the highest lactate tolerance of most endurance athletes. Next time on the rower try to row with 2:00/500m timing using a stroke rate of ~24. If you can do that for 30min without having rowed for quite a bit i would be seriously impressed.
    - galangalalgol 6y ago
      He said he set the fan on its highest setting. I've never used that type. But I've also never worried about breaking it. I think if you don't come back forward as fast as you can, and don't fire in order, legs, back, shoulders, then arms, that you can get away using a very strong upper body to go kinda fast but without using lots of O2.
    - giardini 6y ago
      The air resistance is at max. I move forward until my knees are bent almost as far as possible, my arms straight, elbows extended and then pull back until my legs are nearly straight, my hands at my chest, my biceps tight and the chain nearly at the limit. I'll try what you suggest. Maybe all the machines I've used (about 6 of them) at various gyms are mistuned/broken in some way. These machines don't get the best of care in a gym setting. I didn't say it wasn't a good workout or that it doesn't work me out well; in fact I said the contrary. But it doesn't challenge me in any particular way while it does seem to challenge some apparently healthy persons(i.e., trim, muscular shape, young, etc.). I've read the machines' instructions, seen others use the machines, live and on videos, and, while rowing is not difficult for me, it does provide variety. But I was wondering why rowing wasn't more difficult. Contrast with my recent return to swimming: I swam much of my life but left it about 15 years ago for other sports. I'm trying to get back in swim shape and, while my heart has no problems, I badly want more air faster! Rowing is graceful b/c air is readily available. But in swimming you have only a moment each stroke to breathe. And parts of swimming are anaerobic (sprints, first ~10 seconds of a race). So in swimming I see a clear personal limit to extend.
zimpenfish 6y ago
> Nobody does slow speed on treadmill. Anecdata: People with bad knees (like me) do. > climbers are heaven comparing to treadmills. Anecdata: Not if you've got bad knees (like me).

fennecfoxen 6y ago

Weren't 19th-century treadmills basically the climbing machines you've been praising? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penal_treadmill https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penal_treadmill

galangalalgol 6y ago

Row machines are my favorite. Only cardio machine that gets me out of breath faster than running. Deadlifting is probably faster. Large muscle groups taken to the limit need lots of O2. Nothing works calves as well as mid-foot running though. Maybe a bicycle?

giardini 6y ago
I have never run out of breath on a rowing machine - not even close. It seems like a good exercise, don't get me wrong, but I can row and (talk, sing or whistle) at the same time with no problem. I set the "fan" on the highest level and row for 30 minutes at a time. I could row harder but I fear breaking the bicycle chain at the core of the machine. I could row longer but it really is boring. But I have never met anyone else who rows like I do. The rowing machine quickly exhausts some individuals whom appear to be in outstanding health. I always wrote it off to their being out of shape, reformed smokers, recovery from illness, etc. But if you're normal then I may be somewhat unusual in my cardiovascular capacity.
- cycomanic 6y ago
  I suspect you are simply rowing without proper resistance, it's similar to how you can ride a bike by simply barely resting your feet on the pedals. Rowing machines generally work you out very well, because they engage so many muscle groups and the same time, thus requiring a lot of oxygen being delivered to them. In fact rowers typically have the highest lactate tolerance of most endurance athletes. Next time on the rower try to row with 2:00/500m timing using a stroke rate of ~24. If you can do that for 30min without having rowed for quite a bit i would be seriously impressed.
  - galangalalgol 6y ago
    He said he set the fan on its highest setting. I've never used that type. But I've also never worried about breaking it. I think if you don't come back forward as fast as you can, and don't fire in order, legs, back, shoulders, then arms, that you can get away using a very strong upper body to go kinda fast but without using lots of O2.
  - giardini 6y ago
    The air resistance is at max. I move forward until my knees are bent almost as far as possible, my arms straight, elbows extended and then pull back until my legs are nearly straight, my hands at my chest, my biceps tight and the chain nearly at the limit. I'll try what you suggest. Maybe all the machines I've used (about 6 of them) at various gyms are mistuned/broken in some way. These machines don't get the best of care in a gym setting. I didn't say it wasn't a good workout or that it doesn't work me out well; in fact I said the contrary. But it doesn't challenge me in any particular way while it does seem to challenge some apparently healthy persons(i.e., trim, muscular shape, young, etc.). I've read the machines' instructions, seen others use the machines, live and on videos, and, while rowing is not difficult for me, it does provide variety. But I was wondering why rowing wasn't more difficult. Contrast with my recent return to swimming: I swam much of my life but left it about 15 years ago for other sports. I'm trying to get back in swim shape and, while my heart has no problems, I badly want more air faster! Rowing is graceful b/c air is readily available. But in swimming you have only a moment each stroke to breathe. And parts of swimming are anaerobic (sprints, first ~10 seconds of a race). So in swimming I see a clear personal limit to extend.

zimpenfish 6y ago

> Nobody does slow speed on treadmill. Anecdata: People with bad knees (like me) do. > climbers are heaven comparing to treadmills. Anecdata: Not if you've got bad knees (like me).