3 ms·

I don't remember where I came across this (was probably some pop neuroscience blog or maybe radiolab), but there was some theory about how memories seem subject

by ohazi 6y ago

I don't remember where I came across this (was probably some pop neuroscience blog or maybe radiolab), but there was some theory about how memories seem subject to degredaton when you recall them a lot, and less so when you don't. I guess that would sort of be like the opposite of DRAM - cells maintain state when undisturbed, but the "refresh" operation is lossy.

tshaddox 6y ago
I would expect memories to change more the more they are recalled, just like I would expect a story to change the more times it’s told.
- Phenomenit 6y ago
  Yeah I'm thinking that's because our interpretation of reality and it's abstractions är falsy and that filter is applied every time we update the memory. Maybe then when we are learning a new subject through say reading our filter is minimal and every time we read the same info we combat our falsy interpretation of reality.
- ohazi 6y ago
  Yes, maybe change is a better term than degrade. The story was told in terms of the details in a memory changing a lot vs. remaining accurate.
gus_massa 6y ago
Perhaps the Crick and Mitchison theory about why we dream: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_learning https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_learning (AFAIK it's totally wrong, but I really like it anyway. I hope there is another specie in the universe that use it.)
plg 6y ago
it's the theory of re-consolidation here are some references https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=memory+reconsolidation+AND+review+AND+nader%5Bau%5D&sort=date&size=20 https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=memory+reconsolidation...
ajuc 6y ago
> I guess that would sort of be like the opposite of DRAM - cells maintain state when undisturbed, but the "refresh" operation is lossy. Or like any analog data medium ever :)
sebmellen 6y ago
How fascinating, I've experienced this myself to a large degree. I have a few songs that very vividly remind me of certain periods or points of my life. When I play them, I always feel like I'm scratching up the vinyl surface of the memory, and I lose a little bit each time. Rather disappointing :(
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
mncharity 6y ago
I'm under the anecdotal and subjective impression that I can do a "brain dump" describing a recently-experienced physical event. But it's a one-shot exercise. Close to read-once recall. The archived magnetic 9-track tape that when read becomes a take-up reel of backing and a pile of rust. The memories feel like they're degrading as recalled, like beach sand eroding under foot, and becoming "synthetic", made up. The dump is extremely sparse and patchy. Like a limits-of-perception vision experiment: "I have moderate confidence that I saw a flash towards upper left". Not "I went through the door and down the hall" but "low-confidence of a push with right shoulder, medium-confidence passing a paper curled out from the wall at waist height, and ... that's all I've got". But what shape curl? Where in the hall? You've whatever detail was available around the moment you recalled it, because moments later extra information recalled start tasting different, speculative fill-in-the-blanks untrustworthy.
drivers99 6y ago
That sounds like the kind of thing they talk about on Hidden Brain (NPR). I think I found it: https://www.npr.org/transcripts/788422090 https://www.npr.org/transcripts/788422090 Quote (although it’s missing context if the full show): > Yeah, I think it's really interesting. I think it's really interesting to think about why we do these things, why we misrecollect our past, how those kinds of reconstruction errors occur. And I think about it in my own personal life - I share my memories with my partner. And many of us who have partners, we have these sort of collaborative ways in which we recollect. But those collaborations often result in my incorporating information into my memories that were suggested by this individual, but I never experienced. And so I might have this vivid recollection of something that only my partner experienced because we've shared that information so often. And so that's how we can distort memories in the laboratory. We can just get individuals to try and reconstruct events over and over and over again. And with each reconstructive process, they become more and more confident that that event has occurred.

by ohazi 6y ago

tshaddox 6y ago

I would expect memories to change more the more they are recalled, just like I would expect a story to change the more times it’s told.

Phenomenit 6y ago
Yeah I'm thinking that's because our interpretation of reality and it's abstractions är falsy and that filter is applied every time we update the memory. Maybe then when we are learning a new subject through say reading our filter is minimal and every time we read the same info we combat our falsy interpretation of reality.
ohazi 6y ago
Yes, maybe change is a better term than degrade. The story was told in terms of the details in a memory changing a lot vs. remaining accurate.

gus_massa 6y ago

Perhaps the Crick and Mitchison theory about why we dream: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_learning https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_learning (AFAIK it's totally wrong, but I really like it anyway. I hope there is another specie in the universe that use it.)

plg 6y ago

it's the theory of re-consolidation here are some references https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=memory+reconsolidation+AND+review+AND+nader%5Bau%5D&sort=date&size=20 https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=memory+reconsolidation...

ajuc 6y ago

> I guess that would sort of be like the opposite of DRAM - cells maintain state when undisturbed, but the "refresh" operation is lossy. Or like any analog data medium ever :)

sebmellen 6y ago

How fascinating, I've experienced this myself to a large degree. I have a few songs that very vividly remind me of certain periods or points of my life. When I play them, I always feel like I'm scratching up the vinyl surface of the memory, and I lose a little bit each time. Rather disappointing :(

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

mncharity 6y ago

I'm under the anecdotal and subjective impression that I can do a "brain dump" describing a recently-experienced physical event. But it's a one-shot exercise. Close to read-once recall. The archived magnetic 9-track tape that when read becomes a take-up reel of backing and a pile of rust. The memories feel like they're degrading as recalled, like beach sand eroding under foot, and becoming "synthetic", made up. The dump is extremely sparse and patchy. Like a limits-of-perception vision experiment: "I have moderate confidence that I saw a flash towards upper left". Not "I went through the door and down the hall" but "low-confidence of a push with right shoulder, medium-confidence passing a paper curled out from the wall at waist height, and ... that's all I've got". But what shape curl? Where in the hall? You've whatever detail was available around the moment you recalled it, because moments later extra information recalled start tasting different, speculative fill-in-the-blanks untrustworthy.

drivers99 6y ago

That sounds like the kind of thing they talk about on Hidden Brain (NPR). I think I found it: https://www.npr.org/transcripts/788422090 https://www.npr.org/transcripts/788422090 Quote (although it’s missing context if the full show): > Yeah, I think it's really interesting. I think it's really interesting to think about why we do these things, why we misrecollect our past, how those kinds of reconstruction errors occur. And I think about it in my own personal life - I share my memories with my partner. And many of us who have partners, we have these sort of collaborative ways in which we recollect. But those collaborations often result in my incorporating information into my memories that were suggested by this individual, but I never experienced. And so I might have this vivid recollection of something that only my partner experienced because we've shared that information so often. And so that's how we can distort memories in the laboratory. We can just get individuals to try and reconstruct events over and over and over again. And with each reconstructive process, they become more and more confident that that event has occurred.