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Which is why I wish Microsoft would release an updated Windows Phone 10. I know it never captured "mind share", but find someone that actually used Windows Phon

Which is why I wish Microsoft would release an updated Windows Phone 10. I know it never captured "mind share", but find someone that actually used Windows Phone for over a year as their main phone, and ask them how it was. My son and I each had Nokia phones running Windows phone, as "insiders" updated to Windows Phone 10. The UI was actually quite nice. The lack of apps is what hurt it, though Here maps was pretty good.

1_person 6y ago
Windows Mobile was the pinnacle of the smartphone experience. The release of the iPhone imo was the Eternal September of the mobile experience in so far as it was the tipping point wherein a demographic of users who didn't even need to be convinced that yielding full and openly adversarial control over the hardware to the network operators and advertisers became an uncontested majority. They came with a text editor, a calculator, and a file browser out of the box -- can this generation even imagine not having to run the app store gauntlet of monetization and fraud to Open Files, I wonder?
- jodrellblank 6y ago
  What use cases does "opening files" have which isn't addressed by iPhone's built-in apps and at the same time doesn't involve any risk of using a random third party app that has to be sourced from somewhere like an app store?
  - ocdtrekkie 6y ago
    A file system isn't the greatest design from a security standpoint, but the Apple model is particularly limiting if, for instance, you want a library of data to be available to one app, and then later available to another app. You'll notice the iPhone cheats in this regard, by providing generic system libraries for photos and contacts, but if you say, have an ebook library, and want to switch reader apps, you'll have a bad time. It would probably be better to have a system of secure file buckets, where you could create them arbitrarily and choose to allow access to any bucket to any app, rather than permit open access to the file system as Android traditionally has done.
    - stjohnswarts 6y ago
      It would be nice if directories would allow you (via metadata?) to add an App to allowed "apps" on a per app basis, or at least let you create such a folder so that you would have to interact and opt in apps. Most users would never need it but power users certainly could use something like that.
  - 1_person 6y ago
    The Cartesian product of the set of all use cases of file storage excluding those for which the iPhone does include an app; and the set of all methods that distribute the content of an app with verifiable authenticity and authorship excluding all methods which are "like an app store"
    - jodrellblank 6y ago
      You can get a good app from an original developer using an appstore. The problem you described is not that genuine developers cannot share their apps, it's that users are taken in by fake apps pretending to be genuine. If it was the norm to download a signed binary from a random website, random websites looking genuine and offering genuine fake signed binaries would be the norm. "Are you sure you want to install Adobee PhotoShop? (Signature verified!)" "No mom, Adobe PhotoShop!" "I have Abobe PhotoShop, Adode PhotoShop, Ádobe PhotoShop, PhotoStop by Adobe" "Mommmmm"
beauzero 6y ago
I second this. The apps that were missing for me are the ones I don't use anyway. I want navigation, a phone, text messaging, and a browser without having to disable preinstalled facebook services and other stuff I have been "gifted" by purchasing.
- simiones 6y ago
  I share the love of Windows Phone 10, but as someone who (used to, before Covid) travel around Europe, the lack of apps really hurt access to public transport and even some cultural experiences (museum companion apps). HERE Maps was also way behind on public transport data for anything outside major capitals.
FourthProtocol 6y ago
Nothing comes close to Windows Phone usability. Not even today. Just turning Do Not Disturb on Android on or off is more frustrating than threading a needle. I wish they'd bring it back.
- dhosek 6y ago
  Hmm, on my iPhone, I swipe down from the top right corner and tap on the moon icon to turn do not disturb on or off. Maybe it's not that Windows Phone was so great but that Android is not so good?
  - rightbyte 6y ago
    Didn't Iphone even have switch for that earlier?
    - dhosek 6y ago
      It was to turn the ringer on/off. Do not disturb is a bit more drastic as it takes away (almost) all notifications.
laurent92 6y ago
> The lack of apps is what hurt it Not sure the market would react the same. Many people are fighting phone addiction. Rich people want their kids off the grid. Lacking apps could be a feature in a more mature market. Rich people could display wealth (better the children not be seen with a crappy phone) with a great UX, while at the same time being exempt from the dopamine addiction. Now that we know what we pretty much do on a phone, we could create a phone with all main apps hard-coded and it would fulfill the necessary needs.
lenkite 6y ago
I loved my Windows Phone. What MS lacked was _persistence_. They should have waited another 2-3 years and folks fed up of Apple/Google would have moved to them.

1_person 6y ago

Windows Mobile was the pinnacle of the smartphone experience. The release of the iPhone imo was the Eternal September of the mobile experience in so far as it was the tipping point wherein a demographic of users who didn't even need to be convinced that yielding full and openly adversarial control over the hardware to the network operators and advertisers became an uncontested majority. They came with a text editor, a calculator, and a file browser out of the box -- can this generation even imagine not having to run the app store gauntlet of monetization and fraud to Open Files, I wonder?

jodrellblank 6y ago
What use cases does "opening files" have which isn't addressed by iPhone's built-in apps and at the same time doesn't involve any risk of using a random third party app that has to be sourced from somewhere like an app store?
- ocdtrekkie 6y ago
  A file system isn't the greatest design from a security standpoint, but the Apple model is particularly limiting if, for instance, you want a library of data to be available to one app, and then later available to another app. You'll notice the iPhone cheats in this regard, by providing generic system libraries for photos and contacts, but if you say, have an ebook library, and want to switch reader apps, you'll have a bad time. It would probably be better to have a system of secure file buckets, where you could create them arbitrarily and choose to allow access to any bucket to any app, rather than permit open access to the file system as Android traditionally has done.
  - stjohnswarts 6y ago
    It would be nice if directories would allow you (via metadata?) to add an App to allowed "apps" on a per app basis, or at least let you create such a folder so that you would have to interact and opt in apps. Most users would never need it but power users certainly could use something like that.
- 1_person 6y ago
  The Cartesian product of the set of all use cases of file storage excluding those for which the iPhone does include an app; and the set of all methods that distribute the content of an app with verifiable authenticity and authorship excluding all methods which are "like an app store"
  - jodrellblank 6y ago
    You can get a good app from an original developer using an appstore. The problem you described is not that genuine developers cannot share their apps, it's that users are taken in by fake apps pretending to be genuine. If it was the norm to download a signed binary from a random website, random websites looking genuine and offering genuine fake signed binaries would be the norm. "Are you sure you want to install Adobee PhotoShop? (Signature verified!)" "No mom, Adobe PhotoShop!" "I have Abobe PhotoShop, Adode PhotoShop, Ádobe PhotoShop, PhotoStop by Adobe" "Mommmmm"

beauzero 6y ago

I second this. The apps that were missing for me are the ones I don't use anyway. I want navigation, a phone, text messaging, and a browser without having to disable preinstalled facebook services and other stuff I have been "gifted" by purchasing.

simiones 6y ago
I share the love of Windows Phone 10, but as someone who (used to, before Covid) travel around Europe, the lack of apps really hurt access to public transport and even some cultural experiences (museum companion apps). HERE Maps was also way behind on public transport data for anything outside major capitals.

FourthProtocol 6y ago

Nothing comes close to Windows Phone usability. Not even today. Just turning Do Not Disturb on Android on or off is more frustrating than threading a needle. I wish they'd bring it back.

dhosek 6y ago
Hmm, on my iPhone, I swipe down from the top right corner and tap on the moon icon to turn do not disturb on or off. Maybe it's not that Windows Phone was so great but that Android is not so good?
- rightbyte 6y ago
  Didn't Iphone even have switch for that earlier?
  - dhosek 6y ago
    It was to turn the ringer on/off. Do not disturb is a bit more drastic as it takes away (almost) all notifications.

laurent92 6y ago

> The lack of apps is what hurt it Not sure the market would react the same. Many people are fighting phone addiction. Rich people want their kids off the grid. Lacking apps could be a feature in a more mature market. Rich people could display wealth (better the children not be seen with a crappy phone) with a great UX, while at the same time being exempt from the dopamine addiction. Now that we know what we pretty much do on a phone, we could create a phone with all main apps hard-coded and it would fulfill the necessary needs.

lenkite 6y ago

I loved my Windows Phone. What MS lacked was _persistence_. They should have waited another 2-3 years and folks fed up of Apple/Google would have moved to them.