8 ms·

Is there a U.S. based Chaos Computer Club (CCC) or CCC like group?

by jtdev 5y ago

lupire 5y ago
There's defcon, but it's more of annual conference than an ongoing group that works together.
- lozaning 5y ago
  There's also the local DC chapters, http://dc612.org/ http://dc612.org/ has been going strong up in Minneapolis for years.
black_puppydog 5y ago
My understanding as an outsider who has never been to the US is that the US hacker scene is quite different. One notable difference is a much closer connection to e.g. intelligence services. On the other hand, the relationship to democratic processes, as well as the stance on state/federal involvement in IT problem spaces, seems to differ between Germany and the US. Again: I'm an outsider and would actually like to hear from others how they see this.
- pizzapill 5y ago
  > One notable difference is a much closer connection to e.g. intelligence services. Some CCC hackers had a pretty good relationship with the Russian KGB. They got information about a wide range of US military secrets including details about the Space Defense Initiative (SDI). They were so successful that they wound up dead and a movie was made about them. Since then the CCC has to be heavily infiltrated by all kinds of Intelligence Services.
  - pantalaimon 5y ago
    > Since then the CCC has to be heavily infiltrated by all kinds of Intelligence Services. I think this more served as a cautionary tale to not get involved with this kind of agencies at all.
    - pizzapill 5y ago
      I think the CCC has a strong ethos to not work for such agencies but I'm sure many members do it, either because they are agents or because of other incentives.
  - GekkePrutser 5y ago
    Yes the Cuckoo's Egg by Clifford Stoll recounts this story well. However since then the CCC has been very honourable and I have nothing but respect for them.
  - black_puppydog 5y ago
    At least the CCC of today is actually much more loosely knit that what your comment implies. Much of the work being done to dismantle e.g. election counting systems, the covid apps etc comes from various corners of that community. Infiltrating the CCC would be akin to infiltrating Antifa. Sure, you can get close to a group and learn their secrets, but you can't get close to the center of it because it has none.
jnxx 5y ago
I think what comes closest is the Electronic Frontier Foundation: https://www.eff.org/ https://www.eff.org/
motge 5y ago
There is no chapter of the CCC in the U.S. (yet?). While there is no head-organization (as far as I know), there are similar hackerspaces all around the U.S. (and the globe), e.g. see map on hackerspaces.org: https://wiki.hackerspaces.org/List_of_Hacker_Spaces https://wiki.hackerspaces.org/List_of_Hacker_Spaces
Forbo 5y ago
There's places like Noisebridge (which was an absolute pleasure to visit and experience) or regional DEF CON groups. As mentioned by others, the EFF's Electronic Frontier Alliance tries to act as a regional group for these types of things, but in my experience it's pretty dead (at least the Utah group has been completely unresponsive).

Is there a U.S. based Chaos Computer Club (CCC) or CCC like group?

by jtdev 5y ago

Is there a U.S. based Chaos Computer Club (CCC) or CCC like group?

lupire 5y ago

There's defcon, but it's more of annual conference than an ongoing group that works together.

lozaning 5y ago
There's also the local DC chapters, http://dc612.org/ http://dc612.org/ has been going strong up in Minneapolis for years.

black_puppydog 5y ago

My understanding as an outsider who has never been to the US is that the US hacker scene is quite different. One notable difference is a much closer connection to e.g. intelligence services. On the other hand, the relationship to democratic processes, as well as the stance on state/federal involvement in IT problem spaces, seems to differ between Germany and the US. Again: I'm an outsider and would actually like to hear from others how they see this.

pizzapill 5y ago
> One notable difference is a much closer connection to e.g. intelligence services. Some CCC hackers had a pretty good relationship with the Russian KGB. They got information about a wide range of US military secrets including details about the Space Defense Initiative (SDI). They were so successful that they wound up dead and a movie was made about them. Since then the CCC has to be heavily infiltrated by all kinds of Intelligence Services.
- pantalaimon 5y ago
  > Since then the CCC has to be heavily infiltrated by all kinds of Intelligence Services. I think this more served as a cautionary tale to not get involved with this kind of agencies at all.
  - pizzapill 5y ago
    I think the CCC has a strong ethos to not work for such agencies but I'm sure many members do it, either because they are agents or because of other incentives.
- GekkePrutser 5y ago
  Yes the Cuckoo's Egg by Clifford Stoll recounts this story well. However since then the CCC has been very honourable and I have nothing but respect for them.
- black_puppydog 5y ago
  At least the CCC of today is actually much more loosely knit that what your comment implies. Much of the work being done to dismantle e.g. election counting systems, the covid apps etc comes from various corners of that community. Infiltrating the CCC would be akin to infiltrating Antifa. Sure, you can get close to a group and learn their secrets, but you can't get close to the center of it because it has none.

jnxx 5y ago

I think what comes closest is the Electronic Frontier Foundation: https://www.eff.org/ https://www.eff.org/

motge 5y ago

There is no chapter of the CCC in the U.S. (yet?). While there is no head-organization (as far as I know), there are similar hackerspaces all around the U.S. (and the globe), e.g. see map on hackerspaces.org: https://wiki.hackerspaces.org/List_of_Hacker_Spaces https://wiki.hackerspaces.org/List_of_Hacker_Spaces

Forbo 5y ago

There's places like Noisebridge (which was an absolute pleasure to visit and experience) or regional DEF CON groups. As mentioned by others, the EFF's Electronic Frontier Alliance tries to act as a regional group for these types of things, but in my experience it's pretty dead (at least the Utah group has been completely unresponsive).