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Your transaction isn't settled instantly. The actual money that flows between institutions behind the scenes is way slower than bitcoin. You can use credit/debi

by Geee 6y ago

Your transaction isn't settled instantly. The actual money that flows between institutions behind the scenes is way slower than bitcoin. You can use credit/debit card on Bitcoin too, and your payments seem to go through instantly with whatever tps the network supports.

NovemberWhiskey 6y ago
Your transaction isn't settled instantly. The actual money that flows between institutions behind the scenes is way slower than bitcoin. ... and yet the world turns; and credit cards amount to $3tn of payments in the U.S annually. As it turns out, businesses do not actually care about instant settlement of payment transactions that much, what's important is instant authorization.
- Geee 6y ago
  You just repeated my point. Are you trying to disagree with me or what?
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- dogman144 6y ago
  Yeah and btc is instantly authd by the user. You sort of proved the other person’s point haha.
- argvargc 6y ago
  Bitcoin alone has done more than that per year since since 2018. And there are literally thousands of other projects. Credit cards are small by comparison. https://mobile.twitter.com/yassineARK/status/1346139278636670976 https://mobile.twitter.com/yassineARK/status/134613927863667...
  - NovemberWhiskey 6y ago
    That's absolutely an apples to hand grenades comparison. First of all, global credit card volumes are much larger than Bitcoin volumes. Asia Pacific has been a bigger credit card market than the U.S. for some time - for example. Secondly, credit cards payments are overwhelmingly payments for services or goods; effectively none of Bitcoin's total volume is in that category. In fact, virtually all of Bitcoin volume is gross settlement and relates to speculative trading activity.
    - argvargc 6y ago
      Bitcoin trading volumes are in the several trillions per day. I'm not referring to those. On-chain transactions are for a variety of things, but they are all payments, which was the criteria in question you brought up. Regardless of how you might opine on those payments "merit" (I could equally deride the usefulness of plastic trinkets ordered from China on Amazon - for what good it would do), they are not insignificant on Bitcoin compared to legacy systems. They are all payments settled either from one party to another, or between one party's multiple accounts, and just because they are almost entirely "only" settlements does not imply they are somehow not useful or otherwise to be derided.
      - NovemberWhiskey 6y ago
        >Bitcoin trading volumes are in the several trillions per day. I'm not referring to those. Where does that number even come from? I've been trying to source anything that's even vaguely in the same ballpark and coming up empty. Most of the sources I can find suggest ~$100bn a day. But no, in any case, that's not what I'm talking about either. Nor am I trying to apply any moral value to the purposes to which payments are put. The point is: you can't say "credit cards are small relative to BTC" without consider the segmentation of the payment market in the fiat world. I encourage you to provide evidence of the size of the "credit card" usage (i.e. goods and services payments) of BTC. Good data is hard to find but it's self-evidently not in the "trillions of USD per year" order-of-magnitude. If you want to talk about the gross settlements segment, again, BTC is a minnow. Sure counting every transaction on the BTC blockchain, it's a few $tn a year currently. Fedwire does that much every day, and that's only for inter-institutional transfer.

by Geee 6y ago

NovemberWhiskey 6y ago

Your transaction isn't settled instantly. The actual money that flows between institutions behind the scenes is way slower than bitcoin. ... and yet the world turns; and credit cards amount to $3tn of payments in the U.S annually. As it turns out, businesses do not actually care about instant settlement of payment transactions that much, what's important is instant authorization.

Geee 6y ago
You just repeated my point. Are you trying to disagree with me or what?
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
dogman144 6y ago
Yeah and btc is instantly authd by the user. You sort of proved the other person’s point haha.
argvargc 6y ago
Bitcoin alone has done more than that per year since since 2018. And there are literally thousands of other projects. Credit cards are small by comparison. https://mobile.twitter.com/yassineARK/status/1346139278636670976 https://mobile.twitter.com/yassineARK/status/134613927863667...
- NovemberWhiskey 6y ago
  That's absolutely an apples to hand grenades comparison. First of all, global credit card volumes are much larger than Bitcoin volumes. Asia Pacific has been a bigger credit card market than the U.S. for some time - for example. Secondly, credit cards payments are overwhelmingly payments for services or goods; effectively none of Bitcoin's total volume is in that category. In fact, virtually all of Bitcoin volume is gross settlement and relates to speculative trading activity.
  - argvargc 6y ago
    Bitcoin trading volumes are in the several trillions per day. I'm not referring to those. On-chain transactions are for a variety of things, but they are all payments, which was the criteria in question you brought up. Regardless of how you might opine on those payments "merit" (I could equally deride the usefulness of plastic trinkets ordered from China on Amazon - for what good it would do), they are not insignificant on Bitcoin compared to legacy systems. They are all payments settled either from one party to another, or between one party's multiple accounts, and just because they are almost entirely "only" settlements does not imply they are somehow not useful or otherwise to be derided.
    - NovemberWhiskey 6y ago
      >Bitcoin trading volumes are in the several trillions per day. I'm not referring to those. Where does that number even come from? I've been trying to source anything that's even vaguely in the same ballpark and coming up empty. Most of the sources I can find suggest ~$100bn a day. But no, in any case, that's not what I'm talking about either. Nor am I trying to apply any moral value to the purposes to which payments are put. The point is: you can't say "credit cards are small relative to BTC" without consider the segmentation of the payment market in the fiat world. I encourage you to provide evidence of the size of the "credit card" usage (i.e. goods and services payments) of BTC. Good data is hard to find but it's self-evidently not in the "trillions of USD per year" order-of-magnitude. If you want to talk about the gross settlements segment, again, BTC is a minnow. Sure counting every transaction on the BTC blockchain, it's a few $tn a year currently. Fedwire does that much every day, and that's only for inter-institutional transfer.