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It hasnt‘t to be banned officially to be banned effectively. - Here in Germany buying and owning crypto currencies is not illegal. But try to transfer only 20k
by submeta 6y ago
It hasnt‘t to be banned officially to be banned effectively. - Here in Germany buying and owning crypto currencies is not illegal. But try to transfer only 20k Euros from your bank account to Kraken.com to buy some crypto assets. Then you might get a letter from your bank telling you they just cancelled your bank account, without telling you why. And they will refuse to explain anything. - Trying to get background infos from insiders on reddit, you‘ll hear that there are departments focusing on money laundering that get noticed whenever largish amounts are being transfered to crypto marketplaces. And that their prefered action is to quit an account instead of investigating details.
In the end you realize that it‘s officially not forbidden, but that you rather don‘t touch these assets.
This is the world we are in 2021. Officially these are measures trying to prevent money laundering and tax evasion, but eventually we wake up in a pretty darn restrictive world where you can‘t even transfer 10k euros from A to B without having to explain things. (If and when you get the chance to explain.)
- vm646m80v4 6y agomind sharing which bank closed your account?
- submeta 6y agoFidor. But I hear this happens with other banks as well, regularly.
- Graffur 6y agoSo what happens to your money when a bank closes your account?
- submeta 6y agoYou name another bank account number, they will transfer your funds. ## Edit But banks cancelling your account is not something without consequences. Your credit rating may and propably will suffer.
- KptMarchewa 6y agoDo you have american style credit ranking in Germany?
- NovemberWhiskey 6y agoEvery country with a developed consumer credit market has credit scoring.
- sofixa 6y agoThat's not true, there's no such thing in France, only Banque de France storing your loan and account history that lenders can consult on top of actual circumstances ( employment, etc) to determine credit worthiness
- MinorTom 6y agoIt collects much less information than American credit bureaus, but the SCHUFA does save what banks you have accounts with and for how long - the longer the better.
- Yizahi 6y ago> departments focusing on money laundering that get noticed whenever largish amounts are being transfered to crypto marketplaces They are probably right in most of cases, given how widespread corruption is.
- joshxyz 6y agoShouldn't someone with 20k € go through an otc desk instead of retail markets?
- I_am_tiberius 6y agoWhy should that be necessary? I want to do with my personal money whatever I want.
- ur-whale 6y ago> I want to do with my personal money whatever I want. What you want, and what the administration of the Gulag you currently live in are - on average - two very different things.
- traek 6y agoNo, there’s no reason to want to go OTC for just 20k and most desks won’t will deal with you for that amount. That isn’t even half a BTC at current prices, every major exchange has the market depth to support that.
- BrandoElFollito 6y agoIn France we have Tracfin, an institution that tracks the movement of money. Once you make a transaction over 10k€, the bank has to report it and request from you the reason of the transfer and where the money comes from (initially). They cannot block the transfer but they have several flags attached to the report where they can hint that the transfer is illegal. You buy a house and transfer the money to the notary? No problem. You receive money from the UE, there is some explanation do but not that much. You receive money from a shady place, or send to one (the definition of "shady" is up to the bank and Tracfin), you will need to explain really carefully the move, and you will be on a list. All in all this is fine, the real problem is if you get into a situation where you are OK but your explanations are not - then you are in trouble.
- Tenoke 6y agoI haven't made a single transfer of that size but have made many smaller transfers over the last years from Germany and have never had a problem. If anything I feel like investing in crypto is indirectly incentivized in Germany given that you basically don't owe tax on profits if you buy and hold for over a year without doing anything else.
- tim333 6y agoThe situation is kind of mixed in Europe. I was just on to some banks. Santander Jersey said they wouldn't transfer to crypto businesses at all as a policy, Bank Sabadell in Spain has been ok. FirstDirect blocked my payment as suspected fraud but were ok when I called them. You have to try different options sometimes. Going via Revolut can be a good option though I find them annoying.
- matheusmoreira 6y ago> eventually we wake up in a pretty darn restrictive world where you can‘t even transfer 10k euros from A to B without having to explain things This is the exact problem cryptocurrencies were invented to solve. We're supposed to be free to spend our money without the indignity of having to explain things to some bank or government. The better the technology, the more tyrannical the government must become to maintain the same level of control. We'll either end up with total subversion of government controls or totalitatian governments.
- almost_usual 6y agoSo make all of your transactions in Bitcoin and don’t convert to fiat. Problem solved?
- cambaceres 6y agoCan I buy food with Bitcoin? Pay my rent? Get clothes for my kids?
- almost_usual 6y agoMaybe Bitcoin isn’t the solution then?
- matheusmoreira 6y agoBitcoin is bad for this. Monero is much better. I'd use it for payments if I could but very few people accept it. Unfortunately fiat currencies will always be necessary due to force of law. All governments want to have their own currency for some reason. They make laws forcing businesses to accept their currency and refuse to accept taxes in any other currency.
- x86_64Ubuntu 6y agoNo one is going to lose the stability afforded by centralized Western government for crypto. That's a false dichotomy.
- ur-whale 6y ago>Then you might get a letter from your bank telling you they just cancelled your bank account Time to change bank. And you're in Europe, which means you should be able to go bank-shopping beyond German borders. Competition is a good thing, but customers must make use of it.