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Can you elaborate on why you think Android is a disaster? Particularly the environmental aspect and freedom of choice. If android didn't exist then iOS might b

by m4x 5y ago

Can you elaborate on why you think Android is a disaster? Particularly the environmental aspect and freedom of choice. If android didn't exist then iOS might be the only major mobile OS, so in that sense at least it seems to be good that Android exists. It would be much better if it wasn't widely used as a carrier for Google's ecosystem and spyware, of course.

mrighele 5y ago
Most of the people outside the US cannot afford an iOS device, so my guess is that missing Android there would be something else (Blackberry ? Windows Mobile ? who knows how it would have gone)
- kristopolous 5y ago
  honestly with the rise of the web-app based phone app platforms (react/ionic etc) becoming almost "standard" the friction for porting to a hypothetical third platform goes down substantially. Ignoring the branding law of duality (that generally only 2 brands occupy the supermajority of a product category) and looking only at technical barriers, now looks to be better than ever for a third platform to possibly arise - especially given the rise of ARM SoCs.
  - hrktb 5y ago
    > web-app based phone app platforms (react/ionic etc) Those are cost cutting choices that don’t automatically lead to porting to other platforms. Small players will still churn a single app for iOS based on their site’s react code, for instance. Basically those who didn’t care for other platforms before still don’t care that much, but instead of being their 1298th priority in the list, it might have rosen to the 34th or 35th position.
heavyset_go 5y ago
Before Android killed them, webOS existed, as did Maemo.
- kristopolous 5y ago
  Would you be willing to entertain that maybe they died because most people who used phones found those platforms to be weaker product offerings with the things they cared about and that your value system may have fundamentally differences? Would you further entertain that the inability to perceive such realities and differences and manufacturers inability to navigate these preferences is a major determinant of success? (Microsoft failed here for instance and Amazon's fire is on life support. If piles of money were the primary cause we'd all be using Sharps, Psions, IBM Simons and AT&T Eo, there's something else to say, the failure of At&t hobbit, they had a solid monopoly position) Capturing the consumer is tricky business and maemo simply wasn't the right it. Nor was Windows Mobile or FirefoxOS or WebOS or, ultimately, Palm or BlackBerry
  - int_19h 5y ago
    > Would you be willing to entertain that maybe they died because most people who used phones found those platforms to be weaker product offerings with the things they cared about That is true to a large extent, but it doesn't preclude Google from creating a situation where new contenders are effectively locked out. No matter how good Android is, they're not entitled to that.
  - girvo 5y ago
    Maemo didn’t even get a chance. A literal single device that was dead on arrival due to that burning platform memo. I miss my N9. One of the best smartphones I’ve used in the past 16 years
    - kristopolous 5y ago
      It had a fanbase but it simply wasn't big enough. It's like the vintage synth people. Those are really popular products but most are not popular enough. The popular ones get reissues but most of the time the financials simply don't support a production run. This response in the thread reminds me of what happened in the 1936 landon/fdr election. A magazine asked people to volunteer who they wanted to vote for. The landon voters were super passionate so they outnumbered the fdr voters who wrote in causing the magazine to falsely believe landon would win in a landslide. A guy named Gallop was watching this unfold, thought something was up, used statistical random sampling to guess what the magazine and general election would yield, got both right and changed polling forever. http://historymatters.gmu.edu/d/5168/ http://historymatters.gmu.edu/d/5168/ The handful of people downvoting and passionately responding to me are the Landon voters here. HN is exactly where this small group congregates. There's simply not enough to keep the platform afloat. That's why the reboots have all eventually failed

by m4x 5y ago

mrighele 5y ago

Most of the people outside the US cannot afford an iOS device, so my guess is that missing Android there would be something else (Blackberry ? Windows Mobile ? who knows how it would have gone)

kristopolous 5y ago
honestly with the rise of the web-app based phone app platforms (react/ionic etc) becoming almost "standard" the friction for porting to a hypothetical third platform goes down substantially. Ignoring the branding law of duality (that generally only 2 brands occupy the supermajority of a product category) and looking only at technical barriers, now looks to be better than ever for a third platform to possibly arise - especially given the rise of ARM SoCs.
- hrktb 5y ago
  > web-app based phone app platforms (react/ionic etc) Those are cost cutting choices that don’t automatically lead to porting to other platforms. Small players will still churn a single app for iOS based on their site’s react code, for instance. Basically those who didn’t care for other platforms before still don’t care that much, but instead of being their 1298th priority in the list, it might have rosen to the 34th or 35th position.

heavyset_go 5y ago

Before Android killed them, webOS existed, as did Maemo.

kristopolous 5y ago
Would you be willing to entertain that maybe they died because most people who used phones found those platforms to be weaker product offerings with the things they cared about and that your value system may have fundamentally differences? Would you further entertain that the inability to perceive such realities and differences and manufacturers inability to navigate these preferences is a major determinant of success? (Microsoft failed here for instance and Amazon's fire is on life support. If piles of money were the primary cause we'd all be using Sharps, Psions, IBM Simons and AT&T Eo, there's something else to say, the failure of At&t hobbit, they had a solid monopoly position) Capturing the consumer is tricky business and maemo simply wasn't the right it. Nor was Windows Mobile or FirefoxOS or WebOS or, ultimately, Palm or BlackBerry
- int_19h 5y ago
  > Would you be willing to entertain that maybe they died because most people who used phones found those platforms to be weaker product offerings with the things they cared about That is true to a large extent, but it doesn't preclude Google from creating a situation where new contenders are effectively locked out. No matter how good Android is, they're not entitled to that.
- girvo 5y ago
  Maemo didn’t even get a chance. A literal single device that was dead on arrival due to that burning platform memo. I miss my N9. One of the best smartphones I’ve used in the past 16 years
  - kristopolous 5y ago
    It had a fanbase but it simply wasn't big enough. It's like the vintage synth people. Those are really popular products but most are not popular enough. The popular ones get reissues but most of the time the financials simply don't support a production run. This response in the thread reminds me of what happened in the 1936 landon/fdr election. A magazine asked people to volunteer who they wanted to vote for. The landon voters were super passionate so they outnumbered the fdr voters who wrote in causing the magazine to falsely believe landon would win in a landslide. A guy named Gallop was watching this unfold, thought something was up, used statistical random sampling to guess what the magazine and general election would yield, got both right and changed polling forever. http://historymatters.gmu.edu/d/5168/ http://historymatters.gmu.edu/d/5168/ The handful of people downvoting and passionately responding to me are the Landon voters here. HN is exactly where this small group congregates. There's simply not enough to keep the platform afloat. That's why the reboots have all eventually failed