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http://www.economist.com/blogs/gulliver/2011/02/liveability_ranking http://www.economist.com/blogs/gulliver/2011/02/liveability_... If you can't live in the se

http://www.economist.com/blogs/gulliver/2011/02/liveability_ranking http://www.economist.com/blogs/gulliver/2011/02/liveability_... If you can't live in the second ranked city in the world, it may be time to look in the mirror and have a long talk with yourself. Take it from a guy who moved to Sydney after 22 years in the states. There is nothing I've seen in the states[1] or even heard of which compares to the quality of life here. Not by a long shot. [1]based on living in NYC, Miami, St. Louis, Chicago, San Fran and visiting countless points in between.

jbm 15y ago
People told me the exact same thing when I moved from Montreal to Tokyo. I am glad I didn't listen to them. (Yes, even post-earthquake) You don't understand his specific rationale or the social strata that he may be involved. Furthermore, how do rankings by old conservative institutions reflect on the preferred life balance of a hacker?
- dschobel 15y ago
  Of course, he could have some arbitrary thing against cities which start with the letter 'M'. But why would that be worth posting? I'm trying to argue the more general view of how amazing this country is and how _that_ is the consensus view and the OP is in the minority. He could be a miserable sod for all I know. But again, that's not my problem or that interesting to anyone on HN. The awesomeness of Oz on the other hand? There's a lot of supporting material for that position. I was simply trying to balance the picture for other HNers who have never been to Oz.
  - dqh 15y ago
    I love Melbourne (well, the inner north and city), I just think it's broken for the reasons I've outlined. Sure, the coffee is good and as I travel that is more and more obvious. But so is the fact that just about everything in life is more expensive there, especially housing. Even if I could buy a house in an area where the culture is about more than sport and violence, most of my friends wont be able to. I only see it getting worse as the population increases. My life is awesome and I live it to the fullest, this is just my conclusion about Melbourne & Australia.
jacques_chester 15y ago
Mate, I've spent time in every mainland capital. I would put Darwin, Perth, Melbourne and Brisbane ahead of Sydney. Sydney is, IMNSHO, overrated. Adelaide is boring and Canberra is a freezing public service ghetto; Sydney has them well beaten.
- dschobel 15y ago
  I'm not saying it's the best place in oz, just that it beats the hell out of any place I've lived in the States, Latin America or Europe. The quality of life you guys have is ridiculous. I don't know if a lot of Aussies get that.
  - jacques_chester 15y ago
    I'd like to live overseas at some point, so I can't speak to global comparisons. I just think that if international folk put Sydney at #2, the other capitals I named ought to be coming in at places -3 through 1. (Grass is greener etc).
    - dqh 15y ago
      I've lived in both Sydney and Melbourne, originally from country Victoria. I'm definitely more of a Melbourne guy than a Sydney guy :)
  - malnourish 15y ago
    I'm a very curious US citizen, what makes the quality of life so superb?
    - dschobel 15y ago
      I've been in Sydney for just under a year, I'd say the big things in no particular order are: the climate: Just amazing. look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydney#Climate http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydney#Climate and marvel. Tons of sunlight, moderate temperatures but you still get seasons (so no San Diego syndrome of 70-degrees year round). the people: unbelievably friendly and easy going. take small-town midwest hospitality and invert the xenophobia. common decency, they wait in lines for the buses, but if someone cuts in line (doesn't know or is just being a dick) everyone kind of just mutters and shakes their heads. In Chicago, someone would have gotten stabbed. But who am I kidding, no one would line up in the first place and they would just mob the entrance. I almost took a guy's eye out surfing, his response? "no worries mate, my fault" (it wasn't). scenery / the outdoors: Sydney is the most naturally beautiful I've ever seen. I take a ferry ride for 30 minutes every morning through the harbor. This week there were whales breaching in the background and a couple of little penguins [1] swimming around screaming their heads off looking for their mother. It's like living in a Disney movie. I wouldn't be surprised one morning to look out and see a Koala riding a dolphin and giving me the thumbs up. It's just unreal. On the way home? sun setting behind the harbor bridge and opera house. miscellaneous things: -a lot less religious extremism, it's very european in regard to the general secularism. -the mainstream brands of beer are really really good. you don't have to rely on microbrews like you do in the states. -the proto Sydney girl is tall, fit, blonde, blue-eyed and can probably drink you under the table. -coffee - this was the big surprise, my god they're crazy about good coffee here. in the states you had to hunt for a decent espresso and then fail-over to starbucks. here you can walk into any cafe and get an amazing espresso. I've never seen anything like it outside of Milan. In summation I'd say, imagine an english speaking country with a mediteranean climate, lots of european influences in food and drink and midwest levels of decency but in a +4 million person city with a major economy. And then put it in the most amazing natural setting you can imagine. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Penguin http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Penguin

jbm 15y ago

People told me the exact same thing when I moved from Montreal to Tokyo. I am glad I didn't listen to them. (Yes, even post-earthquake) You don't understand his specific rationale or the social strata that he may be involved. Furthermore, how do rankings by old conservative institutions reflect on the preferred life balance of a hacker?

dschobel 15y ago
Of course, he could have some arbitrary thing against cities which start with the letter 'M'. But why would that be worth posting? I'm trying to argue the more general view of how amazing this country is and how _that_ is the consensus view and the OP is in the minority. He could be a miserable sod for all I know. But again, that's not my problem or that interesting to anyone on HN. The awesomeness of Oz on the other hand? There's a lot of supporting material for that position. I was simply trying to balance the picture for other HNers who have never been to Oz.
- dqh 15y ago
  I love Melbourne (well, the inner north and city), I just think it's broken for the reasons I've outlined. Sure, the coffee is good and as I travel that is more and more obvious. But so is the fact that just about everything in life is more expensive there, especially housing. Even if I could buy a house in an area where the culture is about more than sport and violence, most of my friends wont be able to. I only see it getting worse as the population increases. My life is awesome and I live it to the fullest, this is just my conclusion about Melbourne & Australia.

jacques_chester 15y ago

Mate, I've spent time in every mainland capital. I would put Darwin, Perth, Melbourne and Brisbane ahead of Sydney. Sydney is, IMNSHO, overrated. Adelaide is boring and Canberra is a freezing public service ghetto; Sydney has them well beaten.

dschobel 15y ago
I'm not saying it's the best place in oz, just that it beats the hell out of any place I've lived in the States, Latin America or Europe. The quality of life you guys have is ridiculous. I don't know if a lot of Aussies get that.
- jacques_chester 15y ago
  I'd like to live overseas at some point, so I can't speak to global comparisons. I just think that if international folk put Sydney at #2, the other capitals I named ought to be coming in at places -3 through 1. (Grass is greener etc).
  - dqh 15y ago
    I've lived in both Sydney and Melbourne, originally from country Victoria. I'm definitely more of a Melbourne guy than a Sydney guy :)
- malnourish 15y ago
  I'm a very curious US citizen, what makes the quality of life so superb?
  - dschobel 15y ago
    I've been in Sydney for just under a year, I'd say the big things in no particular order are: the climate: Just amazing. look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydney#Climate http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydney#Climate and marvel. Tons of sunlight, moderate temperatures but you still get seasons (so no San Diego syndrome of 70-degrees year round). the people: unbelievably friendly and easy going. take small-town midwest hospitality and invert the xenophobia. common decency, they wait in lines for the buses, but if someone cuts in line (doesn't know or is just being a dick) everyone kind of just mutters and shakes their heads. In Chicago, someone would have gotten stabbed. But who am I kidding, no one would line up in the first place and they would just mob the entrance. I almost took a guy's eye out surfing, his response? "no worries mate, my fault" (it wasn't). scenery / the outdoors: Sydney is the most naturally beautiful I've ever seen. I take a ferry ride for 30 minutes every morning through the harbor. This week there were whales breaching in the background and a couple of little penguins [1] swimming around screaming their heads off looking for their mother. It's like living in a Disney movie. I wouldn't be surprised one morning to look out and see a Koala riding a dolphin and giving me the thumbs up. It's just unreal. On the way home? sun setting behind the harbor bridge and opera house. miscellaneous things: -a lot less religious extremism, it's very european in regard to the general secularism. -the mainstream brands of beer are really really good. you don't have to rely on microbrews like you do in the states. -the proto Sydney girl is tall, fit, blonde, blue-eyed and can probably drink you under the table. -coffee - this was the big surprise, my god they're crazy about good coffee here. in the states you had to hunt for a decent espresso and then fail-over to starbucks. here you can walk into any cafe and get an amazing espresso. I've never seen anything like it outside of Milan. In summation I'd say, imagine an english speaking country with a mediteranean climate, lots of european influences in food and drink and midwest levels of decency but in a +4 million person city with a major economy. And then put it in the most amazing natural setting you can imagine. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Penguin http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Penguin