4 ms·

Any psychadelics (and I think cannabis as well, but much more rarely) can cause a psychotic break, which can’t always be recovered from. It seems to be more pre

Any psychadelics (and I think cannabis as well, but much more rarely) can cause a psychotic break, which can’t always be recovered from. It seems to be more prevalent if there is a family history of psychosis. No source, just anecdata, the circles I run in.

vmception 6y ago
Even with cannabis, states have no FDA that is prepared to do studies and I just wish a basic level of known side effects were listed from the actual FDA which they do for studied and much more harmful drugs, because they were studied When you add all the other scheduled drugs that have no state level recreational framework, then you no studies and you also have a compounded supply chain problem where nobody knows what they’re actually consuming There are molecule combinations out there which can cause instant parkinson’s disease nobody can give a real case about “the friend of friend” who went crazy because of the illegality and imagined or real liability and its not fair to say “this drug is perfectly safe stop fearmongering, oh wait you should have known about your family history of schizophrenia never mind then lol too late, but everyone else dont listen to that person” this isn’t directed at you, just a collection of things said in the psychadelic community pretty reliably bothersome.
- Covzire 6y ago
  >nobody can give a real case about “the friend of friend” who went crazy This is a very good point. I'm not going to suggest that the commonly cited anecdotes are all wrong or misguided, but a lot of well meaning people throw around anecdotes but just like a discussion about flat earthers, everyone knows about them but virtually nobody seems to actually know any personally. In 2016 the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) cited 37,461 people died due to automobile accidents. Those are easily traceable numbers because they create a tremendous amount of paperwork and news articles. But with psychedelics there is a very odd disconnect between the perception of their danger and the extreme lack of actual medical/scientific evidence that actually gets cited.
- bigfudge 6y ago
  > There are molecule combinations out there which can cause instant parkinson’s disease Is this real or exaggeration for effect? It sounds implausible...
  - tick_tock_tick 6y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prion It's not instant but it's very scary stuff and 100% incurable.
  - vmception 6y ago
    With 3 days of use. Parkisons disease in 20 years old. Simulatable in primates and mice by giving them this drug. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPTP https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPTP https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00000360.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00000360.htm Be careful out there, test your drugs.
    - vmception 6y ago
      (*Within 3 days after use)
giantg2 6y ago
There are some studies on PubMed around this. I remember hearing about one that the DoD did involving soldiers who used cannabis and mental illnesses. I wasn't able to find that, but here's a similar one. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/2892048/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/2892048/
amanaplanacanal 6y ago
I would say “trigger” a psychotic break rather than cause. Other possible triggers include going away to college, and the break-up of a relationship.
- vermilingua 6y ago
  Good point, and an important distinction.
GordonS 6y ago
Not exactly what you're referring to, but after a 15 year-or-so break from cannabis (I used a lot in my youth, starting around 12YO), I've found that I can't use it any more - it gives me the most horrible anxiety! I persisted, but was close to panic attacks, and gave up on it. It's actually pretty annoying, as I have a health condition that it might help with, and furthermore I used to really enjoy recreational use.

vmception 6y ago

Even with cannabis, states have no FDA that is prepared to do studies and I just wish a basic level of known side effects were listed from the actual FDA which they do for studied and much more harmful drugs, because they were studied When you add all the other scheduled drugs that have no state level recreational framework, then you no studies and you also have a compounded supply chain problem where nobody knows what they’re actually consuming There are molecule combinations out there which can cause instant parkinson’s disease nobody can give a real case about “the friend of friend” who went crazy because of the illegality and imagined or real liability and its not fair to say “this drug is perfectly safe stop fearmongering, oh wait you should have known about your family history of schizophrenia never mind then lol too late, but everyone else dont listen to that person” this isn’t directed at you, just a collection of things said in the psychadelic community pretty reliably bothersome.

Covzire 6y ago
>nobody can give a real case about “the friend of friend” who went crazy This is a very good point. I'm not going to suggest that the commonly cited anecdotes are all wrong or misguided, but a lot of well meaning people throw around anecdotes but just like a discussion about flat earthers, everyone knows about them but virtually nobody seems to actually know any personally. In 2016 the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) cited 37,461 people died due to automobile accidents. Those are easily traceable numbers because they create a tremendous amount of paperwork and news articles. But with psychedelics there is a very odd disconnect between the perception of their danger and the extreme lack of actual medical/scientific evidence that actually gets cited.
bigfudge 6y ago
> There are molecule combinations out there which can cause instant parkinson’s disease Is this real or exaggeration for effect? It sounds implausible...
- tick_tock_tick 6y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prion It's not instant but it's very scary stuff and 100% incurable.
- vmception 6y ago
  With 3 days of use. Parkisons disease in 20 years old. Simulatable in primates and mice by giving them this drug. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPTP https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPTP https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00000360.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00000360.htm Be careful out there, test your drugs.
  - vmception 6y ago
    (*Within 3 days after use)

giantg2 6y ago

There are some studies on PubMed around this. I remember hearing about one that the DoD did involving soldiers who used cannabis and mental illnesses. I wasn't able to find that, but here's a similar one. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/2892048/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/2892048/

amanaplanacanal 6y ago

I would say “trigger” a psychotic break rather than cause. Other possible triggers include going away to college, and the break-up of a relationship.

vermilingua 6y ago
Good point, and an important distinction.

GordonS 6y ago

Not exactly what you're referring to, but after a 15 year-or-so break from cannabis (I used a lot in my youth, starting around 12YO), I've found that I can't use it any more - it gives me the most horrible anxiety! I persisted, but was close to panic attacks, and gave up on it. It's actually pretty annoying, as I have a health condition that it might help with, and furthermore I used to really enjoy recreational use.