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> controversy that has little value or importance to this site What do you mean by "this site"? The participants in this forum are the site. I've had discussio

by dmos62 6y ago

> controversy that has little value or importance to this site What do you mean by "this site"? The participants in this forum are the site. I've had discussions flagged that I thought to be valuable. Why would you want to get rid of controversy anyway? Do you want to discuss only popular old hat things? Stability under diversity is a sign of health in an ecosystem.

wvenable 6y ago
Participants want to discuss politics, current events, sports, etc. But this site is Hacker News and it is for specific subject matter. If you want to discuss off-topic controversies, there's an entire Internet full of sites to have that discussion on.
- tpmx 6y ago
  I've seen purely technical discussions being removed from page 1 just because some people really wanted that stuff to go away, and had the power to make it happen.
  - wvenable 6y ago
    Where's this technical discussion? Lets see if I agree with you. Because I've seen people totally make up stuff to make a point.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
- dmos62 6y ago
  I've expanded about what I think about this in the neighboring comments. I'd like to ask this though. When you feel that a thread is going off-topic, to the detriment of the forum, please post a comment pointing that out. Others might disagree with you, or they might see your point. What I find really problematic is when a discussion that I care about is flagged without any input. I perceive it as spiteful, because usually it's me having a controversial opinion, and I'm more likely to be spiteful in turn, though of course I try not to be. I don't mind people questioning the quality of my contribution. I actually welcome it, because I care. Just don't reject it off-hand.
  - wvenable 6y ago
    You might not mind peopling posting about quality of your contribution but it's a terrible discussion for everybody else. Nobody cares.
TeMPOraL 6y ago
> Stability under diversity is a sign of health in an ecosystem. And yet part of that diversity is that ecosystem has different niches :). You can discuss politics, sports and controversy anywhere else on the Internet. HN has a different focus, and many of us (myself included) would like to keep it that way - because that's literally the basis for the whole value of this place.
- type0 6y ago
  > HN has a different focus, This needs to be expressed more often, too bad often people do write that but not in a friendly way and some threads go on with countless bickering.
- dmos62 6y ago
  > HN has a different focus, and many of us (myself included) would like to keep it that way - because that's literally the basis for the whole value of this place. That's where we differ. To me HN is valuable because of the people and the continued success in maintaining a good standard of discussion. To me HN is not what we discuss, but how, and with whom. HN guidelines say that what's on topic is what a good hacker would find interesting, but who is to say what that is? The guidelines basicly say that what's on topic is anything that gratifies one's intellectual curiosity. Again, what I think is that the "good hacker" is us. We shouldn't nitpick topics. We should take care to have good discussions. We consider technology important and relevant, so we discuss it. Same for everything.
  - TeMPOraL 6y ago
    I think we don't differ all that much. I also find the people and quality of discourse the most valuable thing on HN. However, I also claim that these things are not orthogonal to the topics of discussion! Some topics (like politics) naturally induce more impulsive, emotional reactions than others (like innards of Erlang's BEAM runtime). The more you allow the former to dominate the latter, the worse average discourse gets, and the faster good people leave - it's a feedback loop that quickly grinds a community down to the lowest common denominator. That's why stable, quality communities either expel (like HN) or contain (like plenty of forums limiting politics to only the Offtopic board) such topics. And it's not like it's a new invention - a lot (possibly most) societies have a long-standing custom that says not to bring up politics and religions in typical conversations between strangers (or at dinner with extended family).

by dmos62 6y ago

wvenable 6y ago

Participants want to discuss politics, current events, sports, etc. But this site is Hacker News and it is for specific subject matter. If you want to discuss off-topic controversies, there's an entire Internet full of sites to have that discussion on.

tpmx 6y ago
I've seen purely technical discussions being removed from page 1 just because some people really wanted that stuff to go away, and had the power to make it happen.
- wvenable 6y ago
  Where's this technical discussion? Lets see if I agree with you. Because I've seen people totally make up stuff to make a point.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
dmos62 6y ago
I've expanded about what I think about this in the neighboring comments. I'd like to ask this though. When you feel that a thread is going off-topic, to the detriment of the forum, please post a comment pointing that out. Others might disagree with you, or they might see your point. What I find really problematic is when a discussion that I care about is flagged without any input. I perceive it as spiteful, because usually it's me having a controversial opinion, and I'm more likely to be spiteful in turn, though of course I try not to be. I don't mind people questioning the quality of my contribution. I actually welcome it, because I care. Just don't reject it off-hand.
- wvenable 6y ago
  You might not mind peopling posting about quality of your contribution but it's a terrible discussion for everybody else. Nobody cares.

TeMPOraL 6y ago

> Stability under diversity is a sign of health in an ecosystem. And yet part of that diversity is that ecosystem has different niches :). You can discuss politics, sports and controversy anywhere else on the Internet. HN has a different focus, and many of us (myself included) would like to keep it that way - because that's literally the basis for the whole value of this place.

type0 6y ago
> HN has a different focus, This needs to be expressed more often, too bad often people do write that but not in a friendly way and some threads go on with countless bickering.
dmos62 6y ago
> HN has a different focus, and many of us (myself included) would like to keep it that way - because that's literally the basis for the whole value of this place. That's where we differ. To me HN is valuable because of the people and the continued success in maintaining a good standard of discussion. To me HN is not what we discuss, but how, and with whom. HN guidelines say that what's on topic is what a good hacker would find interesting, but who is to say what that is? The guidelines basicly say that what's on topic is anything that gratifies one's intellectual curiosity. Again, what I think is that the "good hacker" is us. We shouldn't nitpick topics. We should take care to have good discussions. We consider technology important and relevant, so we discuss it. Same for everything.
- TeMPOraL 6y ago
  I think we don't differ all that much. I also find the people and quality of discourse the most valuable thing on HN. However, I also claim that these things are not orthogonal to the topics of discussion! Some topics (like politics) naturally induce more impulsive, emotional reactions than others (like innards of Erlang's BEAM runtime). The more you allow the former to dominate the latter, the worse average discourse gets, and the faster good people leave - it's a feedback loop that quickly grinds a community down to the lowest common denominator. That's why stable, quality communities either expel (like HN) or contain (like plenty of forums limiting politics to only the Offtopic board) such topics. And it's not like it's a new invention - a lot (possibly most) societies have a long-standing custom that says not to bring up politics and religions in typical conversations between strangers (or at dinner with extended family).