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It is my understanding that many doctors have found "long covid" to 1. be a thing and 2. have specific, unexpected symptoms. Now it is possible that they are al

It is my understanding that many doctors have found "long covid" to 1. be a thing and 2. have specific, unexpected symptoms. Now it is possible that they are all wrong, but could you perhaps give a few arguments why you are right and all those doctors are wrong? [0] unfortunately I only have a French source on this https://www.lemonde.fr/sciences/article/2021/03/22/epuisement-difficultes-de-concentration-douleurs-persistantes-l-enigme-des-covid-longs-une-epidemie-dans-l-epidemie_6074061_1650684.html https://www.lemonde.fr/sciences/article/2021/03/22/epuisemen...

abduhl 6y ago
These are the same doctors that we now doubt their competence in when it comes to pausing vaccination with J&J and AZ, or are these doctors somehow more credible?
incrudible 6y ago
I can't really concern myself with a paywalled source in French. "Long COVID" is a thing, but is it something unique and specific? Probably not: https://www.vox.com/22298751/long-term-side-effects-covid-19-hauler-symptoms https://www.vox.com/22298751/long-term-side-effects-covid-19... As for ME/CFS being psychosomatic, that's a bit more controversial, with doctors on either side. Nothing is proven either way. Still, symptoms such as fatigue and brain fog are consistent with ME/CFS. We like to dismiss such symptoms when it is convenient, e.g. when it occurs as a side-effect of a vaccine, while taking it rather serious when it occurs after some hyped-up new illness such as COVID. In either cases, it could simply be the Nocebo effect at work.
- jean_tta 6y ago
  I apologize for not being American and the press in my country costing money. I'll try to do better next time. I note that your link astablishes that long covid is the thing, which the parent comment denies.
  - incrudible 6y ago
    > I apologize for not being American... There's nothing wrong with not being American. You should apologize for being French. > ...and the press in my country costing money. Indeed, it's absurd to charge money for articles written in French. They should pay you for reading them. > I note that your link astablishes that long covid is the thing, which the parent comment denies. Nobody in this thread denies that it exists. We're talking about what it is and is not.
    - jean_tta 6y ago
      > It's what happens when you stay at home too much and don't get enough exercise and have a poor diet. Surely this means that "long covid" is not caused by the coronavirus infection itself, but by staying at home too much and a poor diet and not enough exercise. Is that not what this meant?
      - incrudible 6y ago
        It is true that many "long covid" symptoms are vague symptoms like fatigue, it also true that many who self-report "long covid" never had a positive COVID test. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/these-patients-tested-negative-for-the-coronavirus-but-still-have-long-covid-symptoms https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/these-patients-tested-ne... It is also true that staying at home and listening to media dramatizations causes stress, which can cause the aforementioned symptoms. So, if you put two and two together, you may come to the conclusion that many or even most "long covid" cases are psychosomatic and not caused by the virus itself, even in those people who actually were infected. Like I said, this needs to be differentiated from symptoms that are clinically verifiable long-term effects of respiratory illness and viral infection.

abduhl 6y ago

These are the same doctors that we now doubt their competence in when it comes to pausing vaccination with J&J and AZ, or are these doctors somehow more credible?

incrudible 6y ago

I can't really concern myself with a paywalled source in French. "Long COVID" is a thing, but is it something unique and specific? Probably not: https://www.vox.com/22298751/long-term-side-effects-covid-19-hauler-symptoms https://www.vox.com/22298751/long-term-side-effects-covid-19... As for ME/CFS being psychosomatic, that's a bit more controversial, with doctors on either side. Nothing is proven either way. Still, symptoms such as fatigue and brain fog are consistent with ME/CFS. We like to dismiss such symptoms when it is convenient, e.g. when it occurs as a side-effect of a vaccine, while taking it rather serious when it occurs after some hyped-up new illness such as COVID. In either cases, it could simply be the Nocebo effect at work.

jean_tta 6y ago
I apologize for not being American and the press in my country costing money. I'll try to do better next time. I note that your link astablishes that long covid is the thing, which the parent comment denies.
- incrudible 6y ago
  > I apologize for not being American... There's nothing wrong with not being American. You should apologize for being French. > ...and the press in my country costing money. Indeed, it's absurd to charge money for articles written in French. They should pay you for reading them. > I note that your link astablishes that long covid is the thing, which the parent comment denies. Nobody in this thread denies that it exists. We're talking about what it is and is not.
  - jean_tta 6y ago
    > It's what happens when you stay at home too much and don't get enough exercise and have a poor diet. Surely this means that "long covid" is not caused by the coronavirus infection itself, but by staying at home too much and a poor diet and not enough exercise. Is that not what this meant?
    - incrudible 6y ago
      It is true that many "long covid" symptoms are vague symptoms like fatigue, it also true that many who self-report "long covid" never had a positive COVID test. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/these-patients-tested-negative-for-the-coronavirus-but-still-have-long-covid-symptoms https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/these-patients-tested-ne... It is also true that staying at home and listening to media dramatizations causes stress, which can cause the aforementioned symptoms. So, if you put two and two together, you may come to the conclusion that many or even most "long covid" cases are psychosomatic and not caused by the virus itself, even in those people who actually were infected. Like I said, this needs to be differentiated from symptoms that are clinically verifiable long-term effects of respiratory illness and viral infection.