4 ms·

I like the % of income idea.

mc32 6y ago
What do you do with crimes committed by people who have little in earnings (students, unemployed, etc.) or folks who earn “$1” in income but obviously are otherwise wealthy?
- whatshisface 6y ago
  It would be based on the income of all of the money attached to you, including interest/dividends/appreciation within trusts with you as the grantee. Since wealth makes more money in virtually every way it can be stored, and since not investing it results in the "inflation tax," inflation + income tax = wealth tax.
- nemacol 6y ago
  Interesting question. I imagine someone has already thought of this from a tax point of view. Maybe some % of their net worth divided by their age (working age?) - say if they have 100 million dollars and are 60. 60-18 = 42. We would fine X% of 2,380,952.38? The idea being an attempt to come up with what their yearly salary could have been based on current value. I am sure there are some excellent flaws with that approach as well. Fun to ponder.
  - dec0dedab0de 6y ago
    I hope the government doesn't keep track of everyones net worth, it's bad enough they know everyone's income.
- distances 6y ago
  In Finland where all larger fines are day-fines the minimum day-fine is 6€. Calculation is based in your total income (including capital income). Most rich people would be affected due to capital income.
throwaway0a5e 6y ago
I like it simply because screwing the rich and middle as hard as the poors on trivial issues is gonna make it real clear real quick how excessive penalties for common civil offenses are and pretty soon thereafter the laws will change. HN has this fantasy of $10k speeding tickets. In reality it's gonna look like 100mph speed limits, $100 fines for you and $10 fines for your nanny.
- telesilla 6y ago
  Don't excessive speeding tickets lead to a loss of license? This is the perfect response. Perhaps a more sophisticated society will one day know our fears and punish us accordingly (cue film script).
  - throwaway0a5e 6y ago
    >Don't excessive speeding tickets lead to a loss of license? Usually. >Perhaps a more sophisticated society will one day know our fears and punish us accordingly (cue film script). That was a plot line in 1984 and IMO flies in the face of equality under law.
  - Spooky23 6y ago
    For a normal person, yes. If you have money to light on fire you can hire attorneys to delay, appeal, etc. Eventually, it will catch up.
- elil17 6y ago
  Other countries have $10k speeding tickets for the rich who ignore traffic rules. It’s not such a fantasy, it’s a real world way to reduce emissions and automobile deaths.
  - monocasa 6y ago
    Even $100k tickets. https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/03/finland-home-of-the-103000-speeding-ticket/387484/ https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/03/finland...
galfarragem 6y ago
Nit pick: so income zero means no fines?
- klyrs 6y ago
  Yet another argument for UBI, I guess?

mc32 6y ago

What do you do with crimes committed by people who have little in earnings (students, unemployed, etc.) or folks who earn “$1” in income but obviously are otherwise wealthy?

whatshisface 6y ago
It would be based on the income of all of the money attached to you, including interest/dividends/appreciation within trusts with you as the grantee. Since wealth makes more money in virtually every way it can be stored, and since not investing it results in the "inflation tax," inflation + income tax = wealth tax.
nemacol 6y ago
Interesting question. I imagine someone has already thought of this from a tax point of view. Maybe some % of their net worth divided by their age (working age?) - say if they have 100 million dollars and are 60. 60-18 = 42. We would fine X% of 2,380,952.38? The idea being an attempt to come up with what their yearly salary could have been based on current value. I am sure there are some excellent flaws with that approach as well. Fun to ponder.
- dec0dedab0de 6y ago
  I hope the government doesn't keep track of everyones net worth, it's bad enough they know everyone's income.
distances 6y ago
In Finland where all larger fines are day-fines the minimum day-fine is 6€. Calculation is based in your total income (including capital income). Most rich people would be affected due to capital income.

throwaway0a5e 6y ago

I like it simply because screwing the rich and middle as hard as the poors on trivial issues is gonna make it real clear real quick how excessive penalties for common civil offenses are and pretty soon thereafter the laws will change. HN has this fantasy of $10k speeding tickets. In reality it's gonna look like 100mph speed limits, $100 fines for you and $10 fines for your nanny.

telesilla 6y ago
Don't excessive speeding tickets lead to a loss of license? This is the perfect response. Perhaps a more sophisticated society will one day know our fears and punish us accordingly (cue film script).
- throwaway0a5e 6y ago
  >Don't excessive speeding tickets lead to a loss of license? Usually. >Perhaps a more sophisticated society will one day know our fears and punish us accordingly (cue film script). That was a plot line in 1984 and IMO flies in the face of equality under law.
- Spooky23 6y ago
  For a normal person, yes. If you have money to light on fire you can hire attorneys to delay, appeal, etc. Eventually, it will catch up.
elil17 6y ago
Other countries have $10k speeding tickets for the rich who ignore traffic rules. It’s not such a fantasy, it’s a real world way to reduce emissions and automobile deaths.
- monocasa 6y ago
  Even $100k tickets. https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/03/finland-home-of-the-103000-speeding-ticket/387484/ https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/03/finland...

galfarragem 6y ago

Nit pick: so income zero means no fines?

klyrs 6y ago
Yet another argument for UBI, I guess?