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Bitcoin is not, in any way, a Ponzi scheme. It may be the subject of a bubble, it may be subject to market manipulation, it may still play a part in any number
by mumblemumble 6y ago
Bitcoin is not, in any way, a Ponzi scheme.
It may be the subject of a bubble, it may be subject to market manipulation, it may still play a part in any number of scams or frauds beyond the ones that have already been identified, some of which themselves may be Ponzi schemes. But, even if, for the sake of argment, all of those and more were true, Bitcoin itself would still not be a Ponzi scheme. It is and would still be just a digital commodity.
- zabzonk 6y agoThose who got in early made almost infinitely more than those who got in later (or who lost) - classic Ponzi scheme.
- mumblemumble 6y agoThat is something that applies to all sorts of situations, and is in no way a litmus test for whether or not something is a Ponzi scheme. For it to be a Ponzi scheme, you first have to have some sort of centralized control of the ledger so that you can lie to people about the volume of assets they have in your care. And already we have made a complete departure from what Bitcoin is and how it works.
- user-the-name 6y agoBut there is a lie. The lie is the supposed value in USD of the bitcoins you hold.
- ghodith 6y agoI mean, if the person can transfer them right now for that amount in USD how is it a lie?
- user-the-name 6y agoIn a Ponzi scheme, you can transfer your funds right now in USD as well. Exactly the same situation.
- mumblemumble 6y agoLike I said up above, even if, for the sake of argument, it were subject to market manipulation, that would still not make it a Ponzi scheme. Not every financial crime is a Ponzi scheme.
- user-the-name 6y agoThe market manipulation is not the issue here. The issue is that Bitcoin acts exactly like a Ponzi scheme in practice, even if there is no central fraudster driving it.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- IMTDb 6y agoIt also works when buying successful startup shares. In fact, it applies to almost everything that is successful: get in early and reap the benefit.
- petercooper 6y agoThose who got in early made almost infinitely more than those who got in later (or who lost) - classic Ponzi scheme. So did people who invested early in Apple, domain names, or property in Manhattan. I think the bare minimum you'd need to define something as being a Ponzi scheme is, well, a scheme - that is, an intention to defraud people, and I don't see such intent in the creation of Bitcoin.
- user-the-name 6y agoBitcoin may or may not intentionally be a Ponzi scheme. But that doesn't matter, because functionally, there is no difference between an intentional Ponzi scheme and Bitcoin. Bitcoin trading is a negative-sum game. All winning that anyone gets comes out of the pockets of newer investors. There is no net inflow of value or money that could cover the gains people make trading, other than the money being put in by other people. There is a net outflow of money, in the form of trading and mining fees, but there is no inflow. So functionally, with Bitcoin, old entrants are paid off with the money invested by newer entrants. This is exactly how a Ponzi scheme works. Again, it may not be intentional, but it works the same nonetheless.
- dboreham 6y agoBitcoin is as much or as little a ponzi scheme as things like the US dollar.
- user-the-name 6y agoAbsolute nonsense.
- nocommentguy 6y agoIf we look strictly at present mechanisms (ignoring the fact that the definition of the dollar could be changed as it has several times in the past), the dollar is much closer to a Ponzi scheme than Bitcoin is.
- user-the-name 6y agoAgain: Absolute nonsense.
- nocommentguy 6y agoYou keep saying that but increasingly more and more people are wisening up to what the central bankers have pulled off and you calling it nonsense won’t change the mathematics