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When you sign up you agree to the fee being broken up in installments. I think they have spelled it out pretty clearly, actually one could consider it ‘free’ f

When you sign up you agree to the fee being broken up in installments. I think they have spelled it out pretty clearly, actually one could consider it ‘free’ financing in a sense. While I don’t like what they have done I don’t see what the big deal is with it.

gentleman11 5y ago
It’s not clear. I went to sign up once and was looking for text like this and could not find it. I didn’t sign up because everyone says it’s impossible to cancel later, and I was worried I missed something in the terms
slaymaker1907 5y ago
It seems like even the original post isn't suggesting that what they are doing is illegal, just scummy. I think it straddles the line of false advertising since it is pretty clear by looking at the market of subscriptions that there is a decent premium for a monthly vs. a yearly subscription. As a point of reference, World of Warcraft offers about a 10% discount for their 6 month subscription plan compared to the month to month plan. Additionally, they have pretty consistently offered one free item from the store (which they choose) for players on the 6 month plan. The last such item was a mount which must otherwise be purchased for $25 (obviously the true value to 6 month subscribers is lower than $25 due to bundling and since subscribers don't get to choose which item they receive).
- paxys 5y ago
  I don't understand what's scummy about this. Every service out there offers discounted prices for longer-term contracts since they are guaranteed a sustained future income. If they didn't have a penalty for breaking the contract then everyone would just game the system. What should they do instead? Not have the annual payment option and screw over all the people who do want to pay for the entire year and are happy with the discount?
  - harimau777 5y ago
    Personally, I think they should simply sell the product rather than rent seeking. Perhaps combined with some sort of rent to own option for people who are unable to make a single upfront purchase.
    - mardifoufs 5y ago
      Rent seeking? Seriously? You realize that rent seeking actually has a definition and it isn't "any business model I don't like" . This is the opposite of rent seeking, you pay for a monthly subscription to a product line that keeps getting updated and supported. That's a directly & mutually beneficial transaction. Take video editing as an example. The tech it involves (such tracking or object detection) usually improves pretty quickly and the improvement can be drastic . Not having to shell out hundreds of dollars outright every new CS version just to keep up with the tech is a pretty big benefit for a lot of people and makes the ecosystem more accessible. That's true for almost every other software included in the Adobe subscription. Now, it's absolutely okay to still dislike subscription based business models (I do too) but in this case it's non sense to argue it's rent seeking.
      - harimau777 5y ago
        It's definitely rent seeking. Seriously. If the updates and support were valuable to people, then Adobe could simply charge for them directly (e.g. by requiring users to periodically pay a fee to upgrade to the updated version). Instead they only allow people to buy a subscription.
    - paxys 5y ago
      Photoshop is overall a lot cheaper under the subscription model than it was before. A boxed copy used to cost $800-$1000 (in 90s/00s dollars). Even if you skipped some versions and upgraded every 3ish years, it would come to ~$300-$350/yr. You can get an annual subscription today for $240/yr. And that's without factoring in inflation and the fact that you can just pay for a month or two of use if you want. And you're always on the latest version.
  - 5y ago
greggman3 5y ago
Yes, and for certain products they do actually offer monthly licenses. After Effects has 3 tiers 1. Annual Plan paid monthly ($20.99 * 12 = $251.88) 2. Annual plan prepaid $239.88 3. Monthly Plan $31.49 https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud/plans.html?filter=video-audio&plan=individual https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud/plans.html?filter=video-... For Photoshop they only offer 2 plans 1. Annual Plan paid monthly ($9.99 * 12 = $119.88) 2. Annual plan prepaid $119.88 So no discount. The wording might have been poor before because I remember when I first signed up i didn't know they only had yearly plans but at least now it's pretty clear https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud/plans.html?filter=photo&plan=individual https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud/plans.html?filter=photo&...
sherry-sherry 5y ago
This: https://imgur.com/a/yQFQRKF https://imgur.com/a/yQFQRKF is what you see when looking at prices and after clicking Buy Now. It says "annual plan, paid monthly", but doesn't state the fee, it vaguely mentions the price. Clicking 'learn more' does not tell you the fee. It think it's deceptive, at best.
- Meph504 5y ago
  it clearly says "annual plan, paid monthly" which is what you are signing up for, a year long obligation, with installment payments. if you click the drop down, it shows you not only your other options but also the prices. https://i.imgur.com/CZSCvw8.png https://i.imgur.com/CZSCvw8.png
  - sherry-sherry 5y ago
    That is the wrong price. The annual prepaid amount is different from the annual, paid monthly price.
    - Meph504 5y ago
      Yes, the annual plan paid monthly cost more, Adobe wants the money up front, so you pay more for speadinng the payments over a year.
      - sherry-sherry 5y ago
        My issue is Adobe never shows the total you will pay over 12 months for the ‘annual/paid monthly plan’, nor do they show the cancel fee. They could be clear and upfront with it, but aren’t... can’t imagine why.
        Meph504 5y ago
        It goes month to month after 12 months, it doesn't stop, but I grant you sure they could make their own deals sound less appealing, but without a law forcing them too, they aren't going to. This right below the button you press to start your subscription. By clicking "Agree and subscribe," you agree: You will be charged US$52.99 (plus tax) monthly and at the end of your one-year term, your subscription will automatically renew monthly until you cancel (price subject to change). No annual commitment required after the first year. Cancel anytime via Adobe Account or Customer Support. Cancel before Apr 26, 2021 to get a full refund and avoid a fee. You also agree to the Terms of Use and the Subscription and Cancellation Terms. I mean, at some point, you are responsible for the financial transaction you make, this person that is playing the victim in this case had several chances to see what they were purchasing. They wanted a lower price, and signed up for it, they are acting like they are a victim of some trickery. They made a mistake, adobe honored the subscription, and they should too, take it as a life lesson to pay more attention before obligating themselves. People need to learn to treat transactions and contracts as a hostile situation and they can easily do themselves great harm by blindly ignoring the terms of a deal and some how thing it will be to their benefit.

gentleman11 5y ago

It’s not clear. I went to sign up once and was looking for text like this and could not find it. I didn’t sign up because everyone says it’s impossible to cancel later, and I was worried I missed something in the terms

slaymaker1907 5y ago

It seems like even the original post isn't suggesting that what they are doing is illegal, just scummy. I think it straddles the line of false advertising since it is pretty clear by looking at the market of subscriptions that there is a decent premium for a monthly vs. a yearly subscription. As a point of reference, World of Warcraft offers about a 10% discount for their 6 month subscription plan compared to the month to month plan. Additionally, they have pretty consistently offered one free item from the store (which they choose) for players on the 6 month plan. The last such item was a mount which must otherwise be purchased for $25 (obviously the true value to 6 month subscribers is lower than $25 due to bundling and since subscribers don't get to choose which item they receive).

paxys 5y ago
I don't understand what's scummy about this. Every service out there offers discounted prices for longer-term contracts since they are guaranteed a sustained future income. If they didn't have a penalty for breaking the contract then everyone would just game the system. What should they do instead? Not have the annual payment option and screw over all the people who do want to pay for the entire year and are happy with the discount?
- harimau777 5y ago
  Personally, I think they should simply sell the product rather than rent seeking. Perhaps combined with some sort of rent to own option for people who are unable to make a single upfront purchase.
  - mardifoufs 5y ago
    Rent seeking? Seriously? You realize that rent seeking actually has a definition and it isn't "any business model I don't like" . This is the opposite of rent seeking, you pay for a monthly subscription to a product line that keeps getting updated and supported. That's a directly & mutually beneficial transaction. Take video editing as an example. The tech it involves (such tracking or object detection) usually improves pretty quickly and the improvement can be drastic . Not having to shell out hundreds of dollars outright every new CS version just to keep up with the tech is a pretty big benefit for a lot of people and makes the ecosystem more accessible. That's true for almost every other software included in the Adobe subscription. Now, it's absolutely okay to still dislike subscription based business models (I do too) but in this case it's non sense to argue it's rent seeking.
    - harimau777 5y ago
      It's definitely rent seeking. Seriously. If the updates and support were valuable to people, then Adobe could simply charge for them directly (e.g. by requiring users to periodically pay a fee to upgrade to the updated version). Instead they only allow people to buy a subscription.
  - paxys 5y ago
    Photoshop is overall a lot cheaper under the subscription model than it was before. A boxed copy used to cost $800-$1000 (in 90s/00s dollars). Even if you skipped some versions and upgraded every 3ish years, it would come to ~$300-$350/yr. You can get an annual subscription today for $240/yr. And that's without factoring in inflation and the fact that you can just pay for a month or two of use if you want. And you're always on the latest version.
- 5y ago

greggman3 5y ago

Yes, and for certain products they do actually offer monthly licenses. After Effects has 3 tiers 1. Annual Plan paid monthly ($20.99 * 12 = $251.88) 2. Annual plan prepaid $239.88 3. Monthly Plan $31.49 https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud/plans.html?filter=video-audio&plan=individual https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud/plans.html?filter=video-... For Photoshop they only offer 2 plans 1. Annual Plan paid monthly ($9.99 * 12 = $119.88) 2. Annual plan prepaid $119.88 So no discount. The wording might have been poor before because I remember when I first signed up i didn't know they only had yearly plans but at least now it's pretty clear https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud/plans.html?filter=photo&plan=individual https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud/plans.html?filter=photo&...

sherry-sherry 5y ago

This: https://imgur.com/a/yQFQRKF https://imgur.com/a/yQFQRKF is what you see when looking at prices and after clicking Buy Now. It says "annual plan, paid monthly", but doesn't state the fee, it vaguely mentions the price. Clicking 'learn more' does not tell you the fee. It think it's deceptive, at best.

Meph504 5y ago
it clearly says "annual plan, paid monthly" which is what you are signing up for, a year long obligation, with installment payments. if you click the drop down, it shows you not only your other options but also the prices. https://i.imgur.com/CZSCvw8.png https://i.imgur.com/CZSCvw8.png
- sherry-sherry 5y ago
  That is the wrong price. The annual prepaid amount is different from the annual, paid monthly price.
  - Meph504 5y ago
    Yes, the annual plan paid monthly cost more, Adobe wants the money up front, so you pay more for speadinng the payments over a year.
    - sherry-sherry 5y ago
      My issue is Adobe never shows the total you will pay over 12 months for the ‘annual/paid monthly plan’, nor do they show the cancel fee. They could be clear and upfront with it, but aren’t... can’t imagine why.
      - Meph504 5y ago
        It goes month to month after 12 months, it doesn't stop, but I grant you sure they could make their own deals sound less appealing, but without a law forcing them too, they aren't going to. This right below the button you press to start your subscription. By clicking "Agree and subscribe," you agree: You will be charged US$52.99 (plus tax) monthly and at the end of your one-year term, your subscription will automatically renew monthly until you cancel (price subject to change). No annual commitment required after the first year. Cancel anytime via Adobe Account or Customer Support. Cancel before Apr 26, 2021 to get a full refund and avoid a fee. You also agree to the Terms of Use and the Subscription and Cancellation Terms. I mean, at some point, you are responsible for the financial transaction you make, this person that is playing the victim in this case had several chances to see what they were purchasing. They wanted a lower price, and signed up for it, they are acting like they are a victim of some trickery. They made a mistake, adobe honored the subscription, and they should too, take it as a life lesson to pay more attention before obligating themselves. People need to learn to treat transactions and contracts as a hostile situation and they can easily do themselves great harm by blindly ignoring the terms of a deal and some how thing it will be to their benefit.