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Your comment is in the surface a rebuttal of the proposal but it really does not address international criminal law (ICL). ICL is also the result of a treaty be

Your comment is in the surface a rebuttal of the proposal but it really does not address international criminal law (ICL). ICL is also the result of a treaty between sovereign States that agree to criminalize certain behaviors by individuals and, in the case of the International Criminal Court, agree than an international tribunal will prosecute those crimes when national authorities were unable or unwilling to do so. This complementarity aspect has led to the widespread national criminalization of international crimes and thousands of prosecutions against war criminals or perpetrators of crimes against humanity. Arguably, it has shown effective. But ICL goes beyond the Rome Statute and includes e.g. treaties on terrorism or piracy that include "prosecute or extradite" clauses.

slibhb 5y ago
ICL may be a normative good (like "human rights"). But it isn't really law. There's no significant force behind it and participation is voluntary. Compare that to the law of a sovereign state.
- Daho0n 5y ago
  Yes participation is voluntary but refusing to participate does show the true face of the state. Only really bad actors refuse to work together for the greater good. Even some normally seen as bad actors do participate so it is truly telling when a country refuse. Not that it makes much difference but one can hope sanctions will be agreed upon against those who refuse - or more political correct: bonuses for those that participate.
  - slibhb 5y ago
    The US is not part of the ICC and Americans aren't losing any sleep over that.
    - Daho0n 5y ago
      Yes. Bad actors. The EU should add a bad actor tax.
    - elif 5y ago
      And even the geneva conventions etc. to which the US is a signatory are so ignored that they don't even bother coming up with rhetorical excuses anymore
      - thescriptkiddie 5y ago
        The US even preemptively passed a law authorizing the use of "all means necessary" (read military force) to prevent americans (read Henry Kissinger) from being tried at the ICC. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Service-Members'_Protection_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Service-Members'_Prot...
michaelt 5y ago
A believer in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realism_(international_relations) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realism_(international_relatio... would say prosecution for war crimes is merely a side-effect of being on the losing side. At least if you ask whether Xi Jinping will be put on trial - or whether the outcome of Saddam Hussein's trial was ever in doubt.

slibhb 5y ago

ICL may be a normative good (like "human rights"). But it isn't really law. There's no significant force behind it and participation is voluntary. Compare that to the law of a sovereign state.

Daho0n 5y ago
Yes participation is voluntary but refusing to participate does show the true face of the state. Only really bad actors refuse to work together for the greater good. Even some normally seen as bad actors do participate so it is truly telling when a country refuse. Not that it makes much difference but one can hope sanctions will be agreed upon against those who refuse - or more political correct: bonuses for those that participate.
- slibhb 5y ago
  The US is not part of the ICC and Americans aren't losing any sleep over that.
  - Daho0n 5y ago
    Yes. Bad actors. The EU should add a bad actor tax.
  - elif 5y ago
    And even the geneva conventions etc. to which the US is a signatory are so ignored that they don't even bother coming up with rhetorical excuses anymore
    - thescriptkiddie 5y ago
      The US even preemptively passed a law authorizing the use of "all means necessary" (read military force) to prevent americans (read Henry Kissinger) from being tried at the ICC. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Service-Members'_Protection_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Service-Members'_Prot...

michaelt 5y ago

A believer in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realism_(international_relations) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realism_(international_relatio... would say prosecution for war crimes is merely a side-effect of being on the losing side. At least if you ask whether Xi Jinping will be put on trial - or whether the outcome of Saddam Hussein's trial was ever in doubt.