5 ms·

They already have a massive pumping infrastructure due to seasonal flooding unrelated to global warming. The local and county governments, unlike the SFBA, are

by maxcan 5y ago

They already have a massive pumping infrastructure due to seasonal flooding unrelated to global warming. The local and county governments, unlike the SFBA, are not completely dysfunctional and TBH I trust Miami city and Miami-Dade County to handle global warming induced flooding more than I trust the City of San Francisco to handle a sunny spring day with no issues. Also, the Dutch figured out how to live with cities below sea level 300 years ago, we'll manage.

Fern_Blossom 5y ago
Floridian here, travelled the country for about a decade and came back to Florida the past few years. Until you see how other state, county and municipality governments function, you can't really appreciate how well Florida gov generally works. When growing up in Florida, I was led to believe it was the most backward ass state in the country. Didn't help I also lived in a rural county. After living in half a dozen states in a decade (and visiting many more for long periods)... no. Florida has its shit together compared to most other states. Are there problems here, absolutely. But no where near as bad as other states. Especially when it comes to environmental planning and protection. Still some problems in the Everglades area with some fucktards, but on a whole, environmentalism is more active here than anywhere else. Just the news coverage is dismal. While I'm on the Space Coast, you're right to not be that worried in Miami. Plus, there are massive seawall projects that are supposed to start soon if they haven't already. I know they were planned for 2020, but the whole covid thing through a monkeywrench in that. Last I read, there's some $20b being spent in the Miami-Dade area in the next decade all in response to climate change. A lot of the infrastructure is getting reworked, along with water management. It's like people think we're surprised that nature can kill us. We "worry" about it half of the year, every year. We welcome the challenge... as long as we stock up on alcohol. Then bring it on. But if those liquor stores close, it's panic time.
- maxcan 5y ago
  Very true. It surprised me how non-dysfunctional government interactions are here relative to the SFBA and the reputation of Florida in general. DMV appointments are very easy to get and you can get in and out pretty quickly. In CA, you had to camp out at the DMV at 6am to have a 50/50 chance of getting out by noon. 311 type issues in miami are handled pretty quickly, same day in some cases. In SFBA you could go months before seeing public safety issues addressed, if ever.
  - teachrdan 5y ago
    Every time I've had to go to the DMV in Oakland, CA, I've been able to make an appointment online and be in and out within 45 minutes. More importantly, the efficiency with which the state handles DMV appointments is not necessarily correlated with how well they will handle rising sea levels for (probably) the rest of the century. Miami already suffers from regular flooding that causes a mixture of seawater and raw sewage to flow through its streets. I don't buy that a massive public works project is going to make all these problems go away. https://www.washingtonpost.com/weather/2019/08/08/analysis-sea-level-rise-is-combining-with-other-factors-regularly-flood-miami/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/weather/2019/08/08/analysis-s...
    - bobthepanda 5y ago
      Also, IIRC the issue in Miami is that the local geology is limestone, which is very porous. The water could go under the seawall and back up.
throwaway0a5e 5y ago
>The local and county governments, unlike the SFBA, are not completely dysfunctional and TBH I trust Miami city and Miami-Dade County to handle global warming induced flooding more than I trust the City of San Francisco to handle a sunny spring day with no issues. I'm sure a liberal application of SF/NYC money will solve any governmental competency that Miami has build up over the years. Look at how places like Boulder are faring.
dakna 5y ago
> the Dutch figured out how to live with cities below sea level 300 years ago, we'll manage They also paid for this infrastructure over the course of 300 years on a national level. How this will work for a single city in a huge state in a short amount of time is unclear to me, besides the fact that Amsterdam was built at the end of a bay, which the Netherlands then closed off using floodgates. Miami is facing open water. Lots of open water.

by maxcan 5y ago

Fern_Blossom 5y ago

Floridian here, travelled the country for about a decade and came back to Florida the past few years. Until you see how other state, county and municipality governments function, you can't really appreciate how well Florida gov generally works. When growing up in Florida, I was led to believe it was the most backward ass state in the country. Didn't help I also lived in a rural county. After living in half a dozen states in a decade (and visiting many more for long periods)... no. Florida has its shit together compared to most other states. Are there problems here, absolutely. But no where near as bad as other states. Especially when it comes to environmental planning and protection. Still some problems in the Everglades area with some fucktards, but on a whole, environmentalism is more active here than anywhere else. Just the news coverage is dismal. While I'm on the Space Coast, you're right to not be that worried in Miami. Plus, there are massive seawall projects that are supposed to start soon if they haven't already. I know they were planned for 2020, but the whole covid thing through a monkeywrench in that. Last I read, there's some $20b being spent in the Miami-Dade area in the next decade all in response to climate change. A lot of the infrastructure is getting reworked, along with water management. It's like people think we're surprised that nature can kill us. We "worry" about it half of the year, every year. We welcome the challenge... as long as we stock up on alcohol. Then bring it on. But if those liquor stores close, it's panic time.

maxcan 5y ago
Very true. It surprised me how non-dysfunctional government interactions are here relative to the SFBA and the reputation of Florida in general. DMV appointments are very easy to get and you can get in and out pretty quickly. In CA, you had to camp out at the DMV at 6am to have a 50/50 chance of getting out by noon. 311 type issues in miami are handled pretty quickly, same day in some cases. In SFBA you could go months before seeing public safety issues addressed, if ever.
- teachrdan 5y ago
  Every time I've had to go to the DMV in Oakland, CA, I've been able to make an appointment online and be in and out within 45 minutes. More importantly, the efficiency with which the state handles DMV appointments is not necessarily correlated with how well they will handle rising sea levels for (probably) the rest of the century. Miami already suffers from regular flooding that causes a mixture of seawater and raw sewage to flow through its streets. I don't buy that a massive public works project is going to make all these problems go away. https://www.washingtonpost.com/weather/2019/08/08/analysis-sea-level-rise-is-combining-with-other-factors-regularly-flood-miami/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/weather/2019/08/08/analysis-s...
  - bobthepanda 5y ago
    Also, IIRC the issue in Miami is that the local geology is limestone, which is very porous. The water could go under the seawall and back up.

throwaway0a5e 5y ago

>The local and county governments, unlike the SFBA, are not completely dysfunctional and TBH I trust Miami city and Miami-Dade County to handle global warming induced flooding more than I trust the City of San Francisco to handle a sunny spring day with no issues. I'm sure a liberal application of SF/NYC money will solve any governmental competency that Miami has build up over the years. Look at how places like Boulder are faring.

dakna 5y ago

> the Dutch figured out how to live with cities below sea level 300 years ago, we'll manage They also paid for this infrastructure over the course of 300 years on a national level. How this will work for a single city in a huge state in a short amount of time is unclear to me, besides the fact that Amsterdam was built at the end of a bay, which the Netherlands then closed off using floodgates. Miami is facing open water. Lots of open water.