That doesn't justify the immorality of engaging in usury, it's like saying whaling is banned, but there are people who need to feed their families - we already

That doesn't justify the immorality of engaging in usury, it's like saying whaling is banned, but there are people who need to feed their families - we already know that. A superior and not immoral model is investing in said companies, so if they succeed both the investors and company owners profit, otherwise they both lose. It's proper risk sharing.