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" I do believe that masks are quite effective (especially N95 or comparable masks) at reducing the spread of covid in indoor spaces." Why do you believe it rat

" I do believe that masks are quite effective (especially N95 or comparable masks) at reducing the spread of covid in indoor spaces." Why do you believe it rather than know it from solid science? The problem is that the whole mask thing has dubious impact, much like Vitamin D, or washing hands and the rest, but has become a symbol of political allegiance, not medical impact. What was predicted to happen in Texas hasn't happened. There has been absolutely no evidence anywhere of children in schools being vectors for transmission. They suffer very little sickness from the disease and don't seem to spread the virus until they start showing actual symptoms - both of which directly contradict the prevailing narrative. Yet these glaring anomalies seem to be dismissed by the prevailing belief. Even simply mentioning them has become verboten as the response to this post will probably show. I don't believe anybody has looked into whether different types of people from different ages 'leak' the virus differently. That would go some way to explain the difference between the Diamond Princess experience (full of older people), and schools (full of younger people). We know very little and humility in the face of that is called for. What we're doing now is going to look foolish in the future once we know more.

zzleeper 6y ago
Are you serious? Even if you don't know/believe an actual paper, you can always look at first principles: 1) If N95 masks didn't work, all doctors and nurses in ICUs treating covid patients would get sick quite quickly. But that didn't, and in fact they got sick at a similar rate to other doctors (this is from Peru where they had lots and lots of covid) 2) These masks literally stop the virus from passing into your respiratory system. So why would you be surprised if they prevent disease transmission?
- neilwilson 6y ago
  "all doctors and nurses in ICUs treating covid patients would get sick quite quickly." But that's doctors and nurses in a highly controlled environment where we know there is an awful lot of virus particles around. That controlled environment doesn't occur elsewhere, so you are comparing apples and pears. Leakage round the side, not wearing the masks fully, not changing often enough, etc. all apply in the field not the hospital, and even then the network effects can outstrip the filtering effect. Concentrations matter - as it does with radiation where high radiation areas damage the body and then when it drops below a certain level there is little impact at all. Extrapolating from hospital to elsewhere is problematic and simply not supported by the evidence. " These masks literally stop the virus from passing into your respiratory system." Again in controlled environments, not in the field where that level of protection isn't available nor is it managed, changed or worn properly in all cases. The reality on the ground shows that. There is no detectable effect outside really controlled environments without a high degree of curve fitting and bias. Texas has not exploded has it. The downvotes say it all. People no longer wants to discuss rationally the possibility that they may be mistaken. It has become a religious crusade to do with identity. The motto of the Royal Society is "Nullus in Verba" - take nobody's word for it. The essence of science is to question, not censor. We appear to have forgotten that.
  - amluto 6y ago
    A fairly cursory search on the topic of cloth masks came up with this, and this article actually references its sources: https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2020/07/do-cloth-masks-work https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2020/07/do-cloth-ma...
henrikschroder 6y ago
> I don't believe anybody has looked into whether different types of people from different ages 'leak' the virus differently. We absolutely have, and non-surprisingly, the sicker a person is, the more virus they spread around them. And since children are much less likely to develop symptoms or get sick, they spread the disease less, which is why spread among students in schools is much, much smaller than among the community at large.
- neilwilson 6y ago
  So why are they wearing masks then?

zzleeper 6y ago

Are you serious? Even if you don't know/believe an actual paper, you can always look at first principles: 1) If N95 masks didn't work, all doctors and nurses in ICUs treating covid patients would get sick quite quickly. But that didn't, and in fact they got sick at a similar rate to other doctors (this is from Peru where they had lots and lots of covid) 2) These masks literally stop the virus from passing into your respiratory system. So why would you be surprised if they prevent disease transmission?

neilwilson 6y ago
"all doctors and nurses in ICUs treating covid patients would get sick quite quickly." But that's doctors and nurses in a highly controlled environment where we know there is an awful lot of virus particles around. That controlled environment doesn't occur elsewhere, so you are comparing apples and pears. Leakage round the side, not wearing the masks fully, not changing often enough, etc. all apply in the field not the hospital, and even then the network effects can outstrip the filtering effect. Concentrations matter - as it does with radiation where high radiation areas damage the body and then when it drops below a certain level there is little impact at all. Extrapolating from hospital to elsewhere is problematic and simply not supported by the evidence. " These masks literally stop the virus from passing into your respiratory system." Again in controlled environments, not in the field where that level of protection isn't available nor is it managed, changed or worn properly in all cases. The reality on the ground shows that. There is no detectable effect outside really controlled environments without a high degree of curve fitting and bias. Texas has not exploded has it. The downvotes say it all. People no longer wants to discuss rationally the possibility that they may be mistaken. It has become a religious crusade to do with identity. The motto of the Royal Society is "Nullus in Verba" - take nobody's word for it. The essence of science is to question, not censor. We appear to have forgotten that.
- amluto 6y ago
  A fairly cursory search on the topic of cloth masks came up with this, and this article actually references its sources: https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2020/07/do-cloth-masks-work https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2020/07/do-cloth-ma...

henrikschroder 6y ago

> I don't believe anybody has looked into whether different types of people from different ages 'leak' the virus differently. We absolutely have, and non-surprisingly, the sicker a person is, the more virus they spread around them. And since children are much less likely to develop symptoms or get sick, they spread the disease less, which is why spread among students in schools is much, much smaller than among the community at large.

neilwilson 6y ago
So why are they wearing masks then?