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> they couldn't really attract engineering managers and they had to make do with the people they had. How comes? > A lot of managers and organizations are sud

> they couldn't really attract engineering managers and they had to make do with the people they had. How comes? > A lot of managers and organizations are suddenly finding themselves having to manage techies and they are desperately looking for ways to compensate for the fact that they aren't tech people themselves. There are now MBAs that are tailored specially for that [0]. If people think they can just eyeball it with "Engineering metrics", they should read this [1]. [0] https://cs.stanford.edu/academics/joint-degree-programs/joint-cs-msmba-degree https://cs.stanford.edu/academics/joint-degree-programs/join... [1] https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?story=Negative_2000_Lines_Of_Code.txt https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?story=Negative_2000_Li...

sdesol 6y ago
> How comes? Politics, workers rights and so forth. You really can't just fire hundreds and potentially thousands of employees without cause. A lot of companies will have to provide a career path for many of these managers. > If people think they can just eyeball it with "Engineering metrics", they should read this I think we both know this, along with many people here at HN, but HN doesn't reflect what I've personally seen. I'm trying to advocate for "Developer First Software Metrics", which is what my tool is focused on, but I've had far too many conversations with potential customers that wants to sum up a developers worth with a simple chart. In the business world, we don't assume business intelligence will come easy, which is why we hire business intelligence specialist. However for engineering metrics, this attitude isn't quite there yet and many and I mean many companies with non-traditional tech backgrounds want to believe they can easily quantify a developers worth with superficial metrics. Because in a lot of ways, they see developers like factory workers, where their unit of work can be easily quantified.
29athrowaway 6y ago
MBAs make companies less competitive. When American companies were led by engineers, American companies were #1. Now, thanks to MBAs and decades of emphasizing short-term vision, every major American company is being eaten alive by the international competitors they helped create.

sdesol 6y ago

> How comes? Politics, workers rights and so forth. You really can't just fire hundreds and potentially thousands of employees without cause. A lot of companies will have to provide a career path for many of these managers. > If people think they can just eyeball it with "Engineering metrics", they should read this I think we both know this, along with many people here at HN, but HN doesn't reflect what I've personally seen. I'm trying to advocate for "Developer First Software Metrics", which is what my tool is focused on, but I've had far too many conversations with potential customers that wants to sum up a developers worth with a simple chart. In the business world, we don't assume business intelligence will come easy, which is why we hire business intelligence specialist. However for engineering metrics, this attitude isn't quite there yet and many and I mean many companies with non-traditional tech backgrounds want to believe they can easily quantify a developers worth with superficial metrics. Because in a lot of ways, they see developers like factory workers, where their unit of work can be easily quantified.

29athrowaway 6y ago

MBAs make companies less competitive. When American companies were led by engineers, American companies were #1. Now, thanks to MBAs and decades of emphasizing short-term vision, every major American company is being eaten alive by the international competitors they helped create.