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For Western European devs: do try the "USA International (AltGr dead keys)" layout. It's great for programming and quite good for all the Western European lang

For Western European devs: do try the "USA International (AltGr dead keys)" layout. It's great for programming and quite good for all the Western European languages (maybe not so much for Eastern European languages that are more creative with diacritics). I wish I'd known about it before spending a lot of time creating my own custom layout for Linux and Windows, although since I went through the trouble that's what I still use.

toyg 6y ago
It totally f—ks up handling of quotes though. I just cannot stand it, personally. These days, on Windows, I use the Colemak layout, which has a alt-` meta-combo to type common accented letters - I assign that to caps-lock+A with AutoHotKey, and “Bob est ton oncle”.
- rodelrod 6y ago
  I believe you are talking about a different layout, "US International with dead keys". I'm talking about "AltGr dead keys", in which the quotes are available directly and the accents are entered using e.g. AltGr-'. It's not available out of the box in Windows but you can easily find ready to install layouts online.
hnjst 6y ago
I don't know which language you're using but for french I migrated from "US International with dead keys" to "canadian english". I fill that, among other things, simple quotes are easier to type and consistency between OSX and Linux is better. A matter of habits and workload balance I guess.
- rodelrod 6y ago
  You are talking about a different layout, which I also dislike. I'm talking about "AltGr dead keys", in which the quotes are available directly and the accents are entered using e.g. AltGr-'. I'm using 6 european languages occasionally, of which 3 every day, including French. Of these, Canadian English would be only useful for French (e.g. it does not have a tilde dead key AFAIK) and is still different enough from US to be annoying for programming (e.g. the angle brackets are in the "wrong place"). Certainly a big upgrade from AZERTY though! EDIT: My remark on the Canadian English layout above is based on the first layout that showed up when I googled it, but now I noticed that a lot of different variants come up in the search and I don't know which one you're using. In any event, they all seem to be weaker either for programming or for non-FR/EN languages or both.
  - hnjst 6y ago
    I can't find any "AltGr dead keys" variant on the OSX I'm using at the moment, I'll check later on Linux. I don't have any keyboard with a key marked "AltGr" either btw :). However, the canadian english variant I'm using definitely has a ~ key and accepts alt+n for ñ. Concerning angle brackets they are at the same position as on a standard US layout. I assume that we are using different operating systems and that they use the same name for different layouts.
    - rodelrod 6y ago
      > can't find any "AltGr dead keys" variant on the OSX I'm using at the moment I don't use OSX, sorry. Maybe try https://github.com/xv0x7c0/osx-us-altgr-intl https://github.com/xv0x7c0/osx-us-altgr-intl > I don't have any keyboard with a key marked "AltGr" either btw :). That's the right alt (not to be confused with the alt right). > the canadian english variant I'm using definitely has a ~ key Can you type "ã" or "õ"? I'm not saying it's the optimal solution, in fact my custom layout works slightly better for myself. However, learning how to build that custom layout in both Linux and Windows took me time that would have been better spent elsewhere. All I'm saying is that people in the same situation I was in (programmer writing daily in multiple Western European languages), this obscure-niche-that-nobody-seems-to-know-about layout will serve you fine 100% of the times, whatever the language, without you spending ungodly hours coming up with your own.
      - hnjst 6y ago
        > That's the right alt (not to be confused with the alt right). I laughed, thanks for that. > Can you type "ã" or "õ"? on OSX' Canadian English yes, AltGr+n followed by a/o. On the other hand, after paying closer attention to the behavior of the layout with the same name on Linux, there are annoying discrepancies and "English (intl. with AltGr dead keys)" is indeed pretty nice for me too. Thanks for the pointer, I may adopt it too.

toyg 6y ago

It totally f—ks up handling of quotes though. I just cannot stand it, personally. These days, on Windows, I use the Colemak layout, which has a alt-` meta-combo to type common accented letters - I assign that to caps-lock+A with AutoHotKey, and “Bob est ton oncle”.

rodelrod 6y ago
I believe you are talking about a different layout, "US International with dead keys". I'm talking about "AltGr dead keys", in which the quotes are available directly and the accents are entered using e.g. AltGr-'. It's not available out of the box in Windows but you can easily find ready to install layouts online.

hnjst 6y ago

I don't know which language you're using but for french I migrated from "US International with dead keys" to "canadian english". I fill that, among other things, simple quotes are easier to type and consistency between OSX and Linux is better. A matter of habits and workload balance I guess.

rodelrod 6y ago
You are talking about a different layout, which I also dislike. I'm talking about "AltGr dead keys", in which the quotes are available directly and the accents are entered using e.g. AltGr-'. I'm using 6 european languages occasionally, of which 3 every day, including French. Of these, Canadian English would be only useful for French (e.g. it does not have a tilde dead key AFAIK) and is still different enough from US to be annoying for programming (e.g. the angle brackets are in the "wrong place"). Certainly a big upgrade from AZERTY though! EDIT: My remark on the Canadian English layout above is based on the first layout that showed up when I googled it, but now I noticed that a lot of different variants come up in the search and I don't know which one you're using. In any event, they all seem to be weaker either for programming or for non-FR/EN languages or both.
- hnjst 6y ago
  I can't find any "AltGr dead keys" variant on the OSX I'm using at the moment, I'll check later on Linux. I don't have any keyboard with a key marked "AltGr" either btw :). However, the canadian english variant I'm using definitely has a ~ key and accepts alt+n for ñ. Concerning angle brackets they are at the same position as on a standard US layout. I assume that we are using different operating systems and that they use the same name for different layouts.
  - rodelrod 6y ago
    > can't find any "AltGr dead keys" variant on the OSX I'm using at the moment I don't use OSX, sorry. Maybe try https://github.com/xv0x7c0/osx-us-altgr-intl https://github.com/xv0x7c0/osx-us-altgr-intl > I don't have any keyboard with a key marked "AltGr" either btw :). That's the right alt (not to be confused with the alt right). > the canadian english variant I'm using definitely has a ~ key Can you type "ã" or "õ"? I'm not saying it's the optimal solution, in fact my custom layout works slightly better for myself. However, learning how to build that custom layout in both Linux and Windows took me time that would have been better spent elsewhere. All I'm saying is that people in the same situation I was in (programmer writing daily in multiple Western European languages), this obscure-niche-that-nobody-seems-to-know-about layout will serve you fine 100% of the times, whatever the language, without you spending ungodly hours coming up with your own.
    - hnjst 6y ago
      > That's the right alt (not to be confused with the alt right). I laughed, thanks for that. > Can you type "ã" or "õ"? on OSX' Canadian English yes, AltGr+n followed by a/o. On the other hand, after paying closer attention to the behavior of the layout with the same name on Linux, there are annoying discrepancies and "English (intl. with AltGr dead keys)" is indeed pretty nice for me too. Thanks for the pointer, I may adopt it too.