4 ms·

Sounds like: If you want to coast in your role without promotions but still want raises, object to the structure. Or quit. If you want promotion potential and

Sounds like: If you want to coast in your role without promotions but still want raises, object to the structure. Or quit. If you want promotion potential and the wider raise potential that comes with it, accept it. I don't know. Faced in a similar position, I'd be grateful for the opportunity to get better raises with promotions rather than raises within my current role.

_carbyau_ 6y ago
Maybe it is an Australian thing, maybe I work at the wrong places. But "internal promotion" as it seems to be talked about here practically doesn't exist in my world. You simply apply/interview/move jobs, preferably to a complete other entity. If you liked a place, apply for a job back there eventually. The "band of compensation" thing is common though. Once you are at the top of your band, hopefully you get "inflation" top ups but it isn't guaranteed. Hence, get a job elsewhere...
- ryandrake 6y ago
  Exactly, hence my comment. Assume you’re never going to get promoted internally, because it’s generally not possible. I’ve been in the industry for 20 years and never got close. It is just very uncommon. You want to start out at the low end of your job’s salary band, giving you lots of runway to get raises. Once you get to the top of the band, just find another job, rinse and repeat. You dont want to be “underleveled” at the top of the band.
  - eganist 6y ago
    Yikes, and here I am as a manager trying to create employee development plans for my team members so I can vouch for their promotions come end of year (or next, depending on the plan and the leveling-up needed). Sorry you all have had these experiences. In two of the companies I've worked at, I've been promoted to new titles with substantial pay bumps at least once, so this is pretty foreign to me.
    - _carbyau_ 6y ago
      I think it is a culture/approach thing. Where I am, you have a job with a pay band. As time goes by you pretty much automatically go up the pay bands unless you have done something drastically poor. Once you hit the top, that's pretty much it. "Performance planning" is universally seen as mostly for show, so that HR can say they are implementing best practice. If we didn't have to do it we'd breathe a sigh of relief. Different horses on different courses.
    - ryandrake 6y ago
      I'm not trying to change the world here, just making a practical utilitarian point: Due to an HR mistake, OP is underleveled and likely at the top of that level's pay band. You don't want to be here because being a the top of your pay band limits your future raises. It's in OP's financial best interest to bring this up with HR ASAP and get it corrected. If you think promotions are straightforward when you're performing well and found to be underleveled, then the problem is less urgent, but in my experience this is not the case. As the saying among employees goes: "It's easier to get hired at [FAANG competitor] than to get an internal promotion." I know that we HN folks have heard this one before, so I'm kind of puzzled by the downvotes.
    - mtberatwork 6y ago
      You are doing it right. A big problem is that companies are new to having engineering/design/social/digital/whatever teams and do not have much in the way of career tracks in place. So what happens is that you get hired as a software engineer (or some other techy title) and get stuck because there's no upward mobility since no one has taken the time to outline career paths in the org chart for these new roles. This is compounded by the fact that upper management is usually filled with non-tech people who haven't a clue as to what to do with these newfangled roles.

_carbyau_ 6y ago

Maybe it is an Australian thing, maybe I work at the wrong places. But "internal promotion" as it seems to be talked about here practically doesn't exist in my world. You simply apply/interview/move jobs, preferably to a complete other entity. If you liked a place, apply for a job back there eventually. The "band of compensation" thing is common though. Once you are at the top of your band, hopefully you get "inflation" top ups but it isn't guaranteed. Hence, get a job elsewhere...

ryandrake 6y ago
Exactly, hence my comment. Assume you’re never going to get promoted internally, because it’s generally not possible. I’ve been in the industry for 20 years and never got close. It is just very uncommon. You want to start out at the low end of your job’s salary band, giving you lots of runway to get raises. Once you get to the top of the band, just find another job, rinse and repeat. You dont want to be “underleveled” at the top of the band.
- eganist 6y ago
  Yikes, and here I am as a manager trying to create employee development plans for my team members so I can vouch for their promotions come end of year (or next, depending on the plan and the leveling-up needed). Sorry you all have had these experiences. In two of the companies I've worked at, I've been promoted to new titles with substantial pay bumps at least once, so this is pretty foreign to me.
  - _carbyau_ 6y ago
    I think it is a culture/approach thing. Where I am, you have a job with a pay band. As time goes by you pretty much automatically go up the pay bands unless you have done something drastically poor. Once you hit the top, that's pretty much it. "Performance planning" is universally seen as mostly for show, so that HR can say they are implementing best practice. If we didn't have to do it we'd breathe a sigh of relief. Different horses on different courses.
  - ryandrake 6y ago
    I'm not trying to change the world here, just making a practical utilitarian point: Due to an HR mistake, OP is underleveled and likely at the top of that level's pay band. You don't want to be here because being a the top of your pay band limits your future raises. It's in OP's financial best interest to bring this up with HR ASAP and get it corrected. If you think promotions are straightforward when you're performing well and found to be underleveled, then the problem is less urgent, but in my experience this is not the case. As the saying among employees goes: "It's easier to get hired at [FAANG competitor] than to get an internal promotion." I know that we HN folks have heard this one before, so I'm kind of puzzled by the downvotes.
  - mtberatwork 6y ago
    You are doing it right. A big problem is that companies are new to having engineering/design/social/digital/whatever teams and do not have much in the way of career tracks in place. So what happens is that you get hired as a software engineer (or some other techy title) and get stuck because there's no upward mobility since no one has taken the time to outline career paths in the org chart for these new roles. This is compounded by the fact that upper management is usually filled with non-tech people who haven't a clue as to what to do with these newfangled roles.