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Yes and you can say that a helicopter would offer you even more freedom, but does that mean we should build our cities so that everyone has there own helipad?

Yes and you can say that a helicopter would offer you even more freedom, but does that mean we should build our cities so that everyone has there own helipad? Ironically it probably would take up less space than the infrastructure build for cars. But this is the point made by the OP, essentially for the convenience to jump into your car a couple of times a year and drive to the wilderness without having to walk or take a means of public transport, you require cities to be build around those cars. The issue is you don't directly see the cost associated with it, because you're used to it. The thing is, if you actually had to pay for that convenience (because if we would not have to build the car infrastructure cities could be much cheaper) directly there clearly would be a point where you would say it is not worth it.

SirZimzim 6y ago
Yes, too many people can't bear making anything they sense to be a sacrifice on their part. The solution is definitely to shift the car ownership economic burden more towards car owners instead of everyone. Giant empty parking lots and huge roads are an insane cost with a terrible maintenance story. I like to think of it as moving away from a datacenter to cloud based solutions. You don't need to buy all that capacity ahead of time anymore just for those short bursts.
- FpUser 6y ago
  >"Yes, too many people can't bear making anything they sense to be a sacrifice on their part." Sorry but I do not live to make sacrifices for the "benefit of everyone". I already left one country because of that. It was called USSR. And the first thing I did as soon as I could - got myself a car and traveled all over the places on my own. My small software development company does not use cloud either. Self host and rented dedicated servers. Orders of magnitude cheaper that that cloud. I prefer to feed myself rather then keep filling pockets of FAANG and the likes.
  - cycomanic 6y ago
    But you are expecting everyone to make sacrifices for your benefit, because non-car drivers are significantly subsidising car drivers. Lets make car cost exactly what they should be then, things like lets make real-estate used for roads in cities go into rental costs for those roads (via taxes, road tolls etc.), lets price the environmental costs appropriately, including the health cost from noise etc. If you still want to pay for your car then, go ahead, but don't expect others to subsidise your living.
    - FpUser 6y ago
      >"But you are expecting everyone to make sacrifices for your benefit, because non-car drivers are significantly subsidising car drivers." You are making off base assumptions. I am not expecting anything. If they sell cars I'll buy one. If they don't I'll get busy with something else. I am not the one deciding government policies. As for subsidizing - I fucking work all my life and I pay taxes. I do not decide how my taxes are spent. Go complain to your corporate fat cats who own the government. Do not expect me to line up and follow your recommendations. Also get out of HN and hi tech industry in general. It is "subsidized" in exactly the same way so some people can make more money than the others and live in a way they see fit for themselves.

SirZimzim 6y ago

Yes, too many people can't bear making anything they sense to be a sacrifice on their part. The solution is definitely to shift the car ownership economic burden more towards car owners instead of everyone. Giant empty parking lots and huge roads are an insane cost with a terrible maintenance story. I like to think of it as moving away from a datacenter to cloud based solutions. You don't need to buy all that capacity ahead of time anymore just for those short bursts.

FpUser 6y ago
>"Yes, too many people can't bear making anything they sense to be a sacrifice on their part." Sorry but I do not live to make sacrifices for the "benefit of everyone". I already left one country because of that. It was called USSR. And the first thing I did as soon as I could - got myself a car and traveled all over the places on my own. My small software development company does not use cloud either. Self host and rented dedicated servers. Orders of magnitude cheaper that that cloud. I prefer to feed myself rather then keep filling pockets of FAANG and the likes.
- cycomanic 6y ago
  But you are expecting everyone to make sacrifices for your benefit, because non-car drivers are significantly subsidising car drivers. Lets make car cost exactly what they should be then, things like lets make real-estate used for roads in cities go into rental costs for those roads (via taxes, road tolls etc.), lets price the environmental costs appropriately, including the health cost from noise etc. If you still want to pay for your car then, go ahead, but don't expect others to subsidise your living.
  - FpUser 6y ago
    >"But you are expecting everyone to make sacrifices for your benefit, because non-car drivers are significantly subsidising car drivers." You are making off base assumptions. I am not expecting anything. If they sell cars I'll buy one. If they don't I'll get busy with something else. I am not the one deciding government policies. As for subsidizing - I fucking work all my life and I pay taxes. I do not decide how my taxes are spent. Go complain to your corporate fat cats who own the government. Do not expect me to line up and follow your recommendations. Also get out of HN and hi tech industry in general. It is "subsidized" in exactly the same way so some people can make more money than the others and live in a way they see fit for themselves.