6 ms·

Or you could just increase minimum wage (unions help with that!) and get rid of tipping culture. Because fucking with peoples livelihood because your muffin too

Or you could just increase minimum wage (unions help with that!) and get rid of tipping culture. Because fucking with peoples livelihood because your muffin took a bit long to come out is insane.

hn_throwaway_99 6y ago
I mean, this seems to completely miss my point. Good servers make much, much more than minimum wage.
- ddingus 6y ago
  CAN make more. Not so many of them actually do.
  - Aunche 6y ago
    Most career waiters make more money from tips than wages. Customers are willing to pay more when they know exactly where their money is going.
    - ddingus 6y ago
      That's not most waiters. Tipping sucks. The expectation that people work a full time job that does not also carry the expectation of being able to fund them existing and continuing to show up for work sucks too. You've made the same, "but a few are doing great" argument made above.
      - Aunche 6y ago
        If a waiter makes less than minimum wage from tips, the restaurant has to make up the difference. In these situations, the restaurant's margins are so thin that they'd be receiving minimum wage anyways.
        ddingus 6y ago
        That does not change the "some are doing great" argument.
        Aunche 6y ago
        What do you mean? As I illustrated. There is a lot of potential upside with taking a tipped wage, but little downside.
        ddingus 6y ago
        Pull the minimum up, and yes it improves. Without it? No.
        edgyquant 6y ago
        That’s shifting the goal posts. All waiters/waitresses make at least the minimum wage (by US law) and the better ones make way more.
        ddingus 6y ago
        And yes, that is a SOME are doing well argument. Most are not. Minimum wage = struggling overall. Pointing to a minority making real bank as justification for current policy that leaves a majority struggling does not make sense.
  - istjohn 6y ago
    Are you speaking from actual experience? I was a server for several years, and virtually everyone made 1.5 to 2 times more than minimum wage from tips. A few made triple minimum wage. The employees that were not tipped such as hosts made half what their tipped counterparts took home. Tipping is GREAT for workers in my experience.
    - pmiller2 6y ago
      Oh, wow, so some people actually made a living wage. Yeah, that sounds great.
      - istjohn 6y ago
        Is that sarcasm? The alternative to tipping is not servers at Olive Garden getting paid $20/hr in straight wages. If people want to advocate for servers and bartenders, they should make sure that what they are pushing for will actually make food service workers better off. Serving isn't a great job, but it's far better than many other service sector jobs, and there are people who raise families waiting on tables. It's incredibly frustrating to hear well-meaning but misinformed progressives argue for policies that would make the lives of people I worked with and respect much harder.
        pmiller2 6y ago
        No, it's not sarcasm. If a business can't afford to exist without abusing workers by paying below a living wage, that business's business model needs to be rethought. If that means people don't get unlimited breadsticks and have to pay a little more on the check, then that's what it means. And, I do mean "a little more": McDonalds workers in Denmark make at least $20/hour, get excellent benefits, and a Big Mac costs a whole $0.27 more than in the US. https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/mcdonalds-workers-denmark/ https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/mcdonalds-workers-denmark/
- whoisburbansky 6y ago
  Most places in the world with reasonable minimum wages /actually/ use tipping as a way to reward good service, as opposed to an additional, morally mandated tax. Under a higher minimum wage, good servers would still make plenty if their service was truly worth compensating extra for, wouldn’t they?
- onethought 6y ago
  Do US servers make more than Australian servers? Australia with a minimum wage of around $17 USD compared with US average of around $7.50 USD. What is the average wage:tips ratio for US servers?

Or you could just increase minimum wage (unions help with that!) and get rid of tipping culture. Because fucking with peoples livelihood because your muffin took a bit long to come out is insane.

hn_throwaway_99 6y ago

I mean, this seems to completely miss my point. Good servers make much, much more than minimum wage.

ddingus 6y ago
CAN make more. Not so many of them actually do.
- Aunche 6y ago
  Most career waiters make more money from tips than wages. Customers are willing to pay more when they know exactly where their money is going.
  - ddingus 6y ago
    That's not most waiters. Tipping sucks. The expectation that people work a full time job that does not also carry the expectation of being able to fund them existing and continuing to show up for work sucks too. You've made the same, "but a few are doing great" argument made above.
    - Aunche 6y ago
      If a waiter makes less than minimum wage from tips, the restaurant has to make up the difference. In these situations, the restaurant's margins are so thin that they'd be receiving minimum wage anyways.
      - ddingus 6y ago
        That does not change the "some are doing great" argument.
        Aunche 6y ago
        What do you mean? As I illustrated. There is a lot of potential upside with taking a tipped wage, but little downside.
        ddingus 6y ago
        Pull the minimum up, and yes it improves. Without it? No.
        edgyquant 6y ago
        That’s shifting the goal posts. All waiters/waitresses make at least the minimum wage (by US law) and the better ones make way more.
        ddingus 6y ago
        And yes, that is a SOME are doing well argument. Most are not. Minimum wage = struggling overall. Pointing to a minority making real bank as justification for current policy that leaves a majority struggling does not make sense.
- istjohn 6y ago
  Are you speaking from actual experience? I was a server for several years, and virtually everyone made 1.5 to 2 times more than minimum wage from tips. A few made triple minimum wage. The employees that were not tipped such as hosts made half what their tipped counterparts took home. Tipping is GREAT for workers in my experience.
  - pmiller2 6y ago
    Oh, wow, so some people actually made a living wage. Yeah, that sounds great.
    - istjohn 6y ago
      Is that sarcasm? The alternative to tipping is not servers at Olive Garden getting paid $20/hr in straight wages. If people want to advocate for servers and bartenders, they should make sure that what they are pushing for will actually make food service workers better off. Serving isn't a great job, but it's far better than many other service sector jobs, and there are people who raise families waiting on tables. It's incredibly frustrating to hear well-meaning but misinformed progressives argue for policies that would make the lives of people I worked with and respect much harder.
      - pmiller2 6y ago
        No, it's not sarcasm. If a business can't afford to exist without abusing workers by paying below a living wage, that business's business model needs to be rethought. If that means people don't get unlimited breadsticks and have to pay a little more on the check, then that's what it means. And, I do mean "a little more": McDonalds workers in Denmark make at least $20/hour, get excellent benefits, and a Big Mac costs a whole $0.27 more than in the US. https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/mcdonalds-workers-denmark/ https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/mcdonalds-workers-denmark/
whoisburbansky 6y ago
Most places in the world with reasonable minimum wages /actually/ use tipping as a way to reward good service, as opposed to an additional, morally mandated tax. Under a higher minimum wage, good servers would still make plenty if their service was truly worth compensating extra for, wouldn’t they?
onethought 6y ago
Do US servers make more than Australian servers? Australia with a minimum wage of around $17 USD compared with US average of around $7.50 USD. What is the average wage:tips ratio for US servers?