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Maybe it's the American in me, but I have almost no use for a payment mechanism in my messenger, I have too many. Venmo, Cash, Apple's thing, Google Wallet, wha
by aseipp 6y ago
Maybe it's the American in me, but I have almost no use for a payment mechanism in my messenger, I have too many. Venmo, Cash, Apple's thing, Google Wallet, whatever -- these all provide everything I need when I need to send money to people. Frankly the idea that I suddenly might have to have another goddamn thing is a bit irritating but I've resigned myself to it.
I think the other thing is that it's just a complete misread of how normal people even think about crypto. Literally every "normie" I know who has interest in cryptocurrency, even if they tow the line and say that "crypto is the future of money" or whatever, treat it entirely as a speculative asset when it comes down to it and that's what their usage of it revolves around. It's a thing they put $5 and that $5 becomes $10 later on and now they have $10. Sending it to other people is literally the last thing they want to do. As far as they're concerned, it's the exact same way the stock market works, only faster. None of them care about deflation or border politics or monetary privacy or whatever; it's practically just a way of flipping a bullshit asset into fiat cash, which is what matters. If they want to give people or their drug dealer money in a way that isn't on the record, they don't pull out their instant messenger and say "Let's use a blockchain to preserve our privacy during this transaction", they "pull cash from an ATM and do it in the bathroom of a bar" or whatever. They arrange this over SMS, probably, or maybe Signal already if you're lucky.
Finally there's people like me, people who neither care that Signal is non-federated and don't care that it uses phone numbers, but who just think the cure is worse than the disease here. I'm not even talking about the politics of money exchange or privacy or anything; I just literally mean cryptocurrency invites fraudsters and scammers and all kinds of bullshit along with it, that ends up causing external harm to people. I don't want Signal to expend resources on this stuff because even if it aligns with their goals on paper or is something their competitors might do, I literally think it's turf they shouldn't be on because fundamentally the people who play that game have other goals in mind.
- sneak 6y ago> Maybe it's the American in me, but I have almost no use for a payment mechanism in my messenger, I have too many. Venmo, Cash, Apple's thing, Google Wallet, whatever -- these all provide everything I need when I need to send money to people. All of those require doxxing yourself to the vendor, submitting to financial (suspicionless) mass surveillance systems, and can be trivially censored without any burden of proof or even probable cause to suspect wrongdoing by the entire machinery of the state. We saw this when Visa and Mastercard and PayPal willingly shut down donations to Wikileaks simply because the state asked - no legal compulsion was even necessary. I hold US citizenship and don't use any of the aforementioned services for those reasons. I don't like providing identity information to services where I don't have to, because I value my privacy: same reason I use Signal, same reason I pay in cash. Cryptocurrencies are censorship resistant and are open to use by everyone with an internet connection, just like Signal. There is a huge benefit to the service provider not having your identity or being able to see the contents of your messages: to the user, to the service provider, and to society.
- Bjartr 6y agoI don't think you should be getting downvoted. You clearly hold strongly to your values. There's nothing wrong with that. And you're adding to the discussion by providing your perspective, not being rude or attacking anyone.
- hedora 6y agoThere’s a set of people on HN that downvote and flag anything that they disagree with. I don’t really understand the mindset, but have noticed they usually agree with whatever the US government, FAANG or other authority is pushing for. (Maybe they’re authoritarian, and that’s why they think anything outside approved narratives needs a downvote? That’s my best guess.) Anyway, it’s best to treat them like trolls: just ignore them. Upvote anything that renders in gray and isn’t violating site guidelines. I’ve found my best comments tend to wildly oscillate around zero for a while, then end up slightly positive. :-)
- zepto 6y agoMy assumption is that sneak is not being downvoted for his views, which for the most part seem reasonable and informative, but for his rhetoric.
- zepto 6y ago> Cryptocurrencies are censorship resistant Rubber hoses are a thing.
- tzs 6y ago> Maybe it's the American in me, but I have almost no use for a payment mechanism in my messenger, I have too many. Venmo, Cash, Apple's thing, Google Wallet, whatever -- these all provide everything I need when I need to send money to people. Don't forget Zelle, which is similar to Venmo but is already built into the apps and websites of a large number of US banks. It's owned indirectly by Bank of America, BB&T, Capital One, JPMorgan Chase, PNC Bank, U.S. Bank, and Wells Fargo. Other major banks, including Chase and Citi, also include it. That means that a very large number of Americans can do quick and easy US to US payments by phone number of email just using their normal banking apps and sites.
- blueblob 6y agoI find Zelle super frustrating. I needed to transfer money from a local credit union to Citizen's bank because there isn't a Citizen's near me. Both support Zelle, except that you can only have one account set up in Zelle. So I literally couldn't even transfer money to my other account through Zelle. Instead, I have to mobile deposit a check to myself.