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> Amazon would split off its profitable parts (AWS/services), which would make the barely profitable parts of Amazon worse for everyone. Okay but how is that a

> Amazon would split off its profitable parts (AWS/services), which would make the barely profitable parts of Amazon worse for everyone. Okay but how is that actually bad? The barely profitable parts of Amazon, ie the retail operation, are already pretty comprehensively lousy. Making it unprofitable to more or less monopolize retail, the way Amazon does now, seems like it would open competition back up among ecommerce business on a smaller scale. As I've discovered since quitting Amazon myself, with platforms like Stripe and Shopify, human-scale ecommerce no longer needs to be - or is! - the patchwork headache we all remember unfondly from 2005. The experience at point of sale is consistent, reliable, quick, and pleasant. The money goes to support small businesses, rather than being shoveled directly into the flaming mouth of Mammon. And while it does take a little longer for shipments to arrive, that's actually also a net good because almost nothing actually needs the kind of unsustainable next-day Prime treatment that Amazon's retail operation insists on by default. Without Amazon's perverse incentives toward counterfeit garbage, the rate at which I've had what I get match what I order has so far been 100%. And without Amazon Logistics involved, I can be fairly confident besides that whoever did the work of delivering that order probably was not denied the basic human dignity of access to toilet facilities because of rampant Taylorism or for any other reason. You've really made a remarkably strong case for the thing you're arguing against! I doubt that's what you wanted, but I appreciate it all the same.

greggyb 6y ago
Fun fact: Amazon is <10% of retail in the US, and lower globally. I don't really have much to disagree with you about, but maybe you want to check the "monopoly" claim.
- throwanem 6y ago
  I used "monopolize" loosely, sure. Maybe they don't entirely, but they clearly want to. (And don't they? How much of b2c ecommerce are they? - how has the pandemic affected their share? You seem to have readier access to that data than I do!)
  - greggyb 6y ago
    I've just come across the statistic before. Here's a quick search hit, saying e-commerce as of a year and a bit ago that indicates 35% of e-commerce. https://www.ben-evans.com/benedictevans/2019/12/amazons-market-share19 https://www.ben-evans.com/benedictevans/2019/12/amazons-mark... Maybe they do want to monopolize, but I'm pretty sure that they couldn't, what with Walmart, Target, eBay, Ali Express, and other major global players in the space. Amazon's want is largely irrelevant to a conversation like this.
    - throwanem 6y ago
      On the other hand, it's harder to make a sentence flow around "oligopolistic". I feel like seeing that Amazon owned a third of US ecommerce, before the pandemic stomped brick-and-mortar flat, goes more to my point than to yours.
      - greggyb 6y ago
        Your point has changed at least twice in this thread. My point was simply that "monopoly" is not an accurate term here. You can't say "oligopoly may be more accurate, so I've been correct."
        throwanem 6y ago
        Sure I can! You're quibbling over my choice of a single, admittedly inexact but contextually plain, word, rather than engage at all with the actual point I made. I'm just trying to meet you where you are.
        JumpCrisscross 6y ago
        > a single, admittedly inexact but contextually plain, word Within the context of a policy discussion, a monopoly versus oligopoly is a pretty material difference. Every growing business at some level “wants” to monopolise their niche.
- jimnotgym 6y ago
  But their retail presence is often at the expense of SMEs Look how the small ecommerce companies have all become FBA companies
  - castlecrasher2 6y ago
    >Look how the small ecommerce companies have all become FBA companies While I suspect you're right in that many have, I don't believe it's anywhere near a majority.
    - dredmorbius 6y ago
      FBA: fulfillment by Amazon. https://sell.amazon.com/fulfillment-by-amazon.html https://sell.amazon.com/fulfillment-by-amazon.html Or in the alternative, Fellow of the British Academy. https://www.acronymfinder.com/FBA.html https://www.acronymfinder.com/FBA.html

greggyb 6y ago

Fun fact: Amazon is <10% of retail in the US, and lower globally. I don't really have much to disagree with you about, but maybe you want to check the "monopoly" claim.

throwanem 6y ago
I used "monopolize" loosely, sure. Maybe they don't entirely, but they clearly want to. (And don't they? How much of b2c ecommerce are they? - how has the pandemic affected their share? You seem to have readier access to that data than I do!)
- greggyb 6y ago
  I've just come across the statistic before. Here's a quick search hit, saying e-commerce as of a year and a bit ago that indicates 35% of e-commerce. https://www.ben-evans.com/benedictevans/2019/12/amazons-market-share19 https://www.ben-evans.com/benedictevans/2019/12/amazons-mark... Maybe they do want to monopolize, but I'm pretty sure that they couldn't, what with Walmart, Target, eBay, Ali Express, and other major global players in the space. Amazon's want is largely irrelevant to a conversation like this.
  - throwanem 6y ago
    On the other hand, it's harder to make a sentence flow around "oligopolistic". I feel like seeing that Amazon owned a third of US ecommerce, before the pandemic stomped brick-and-mortar flat, goes more to my point than to yours.
    - greggyb 6y ago
      Your point has changed at least twice in this thread. My point was simply that "monopoly" is not an accurate term here. You can't say "oligopoly may be more accurate, so I've been correct."
      - throwanem 6y ago
        Sure I can! You're quibbling over my choice of a single, admittedly inexact but contextually plain, word, rather than engage at all with the actual point I made. I'm just trying to meet you where you are.
        JumpCrisscross 6y ago
        > a single, admittedly inexact but contextually plain, word Within the context of a policy discussion, a monopoly versus oligopoly is a pretty material difference. Every growing business at some level “wants” to monopolise their niche.
jimnotgym 6y ago
But their retail presence is often at the expense of SMEs Look how the small ecommerce companies have all become FBA companies
- castlecrasher2 6y ago
  >Look how the small ecommerce companies have all become FBA companies While I suspect you're right in that many have, I don't believe it's anywhere near a majority.
  - dredmorbius 6y ago
    FBA: fulfillment by Amazon. https://sell.amazon.com/fulfillment-by-amazon.html https://sell.amazon.com/fulfillment-by-amazon.html Or in the alternative, Fellow of the British Academy. https://www.acronymfinder.com/FBA.html https://www.acronymfinder.com/FBA.html