3 ms·

Always in awe to read about assemblies of great minds like at Princeton's IAS. Does another such assembly exist today? I don't think it does but want to know i

Always in awe to read about assemblies of great minds like at Princeton's IAS. Does another such assembly exist today? I don't think it does but want to know if others can point to one. Did it happen then because the discoveries were "low hanging" enough that they would be found eventually, such that today we've basically exhausted the major discoverable parts of nature given human limitations, like a depleting orebody where what's left are marginally economic residuals? Or was there something in particular about Western societies a century or two ago that produced such brilliance (or even specifically the Habsburgs's HRE where von Neumann was from), which perhaps we can learn from to steer things today?

belter 6y ago
Just reading the duties of his assistant makes you realize you should really reserve the word Genius for a few. And he certainly was one of them: "The Duties of John von Neumann’s Assistant" https://www.cantorsparadise.com/the-duties-of-john-von-neumanns-assistant-in-the-1930s-8d08e538fe2b https://www.cantorsparadise.com/the-duties-of-john-von-neuma...
ramraj07 6y ago
There have been attempts at this (new bell labs janelia farms) but I feel like the current academic system filters out the type of minds that work in such situations, and every attempt at a new bell lab recruits from the same system.
TMWNN 6y ago
>(or even specifically the Habsburgs's HRE where von Neumann was from) It is not a coincidence that the "Martians" of Budapest, of which von Neumann was one, were all Ashkenazi Jewish. Societal and genetic pressures over centuries produced unusually high IQs (and some associated genetic problems). https://web.mit.edu/fustflum/documents/papers/AshkenaziIQ.jbiosocsci.pdf https://web.mit.edu/fustflum/documents/papers/AshkenaziIQ.jb...
- hospes 6y ago
  Can someone please explain why this is being downvoted? That is true, “martians” were all Jewish and Ashkenazi Jews have high percentage of high IQ representatives compared to other ethnic groups.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - joelbluminator 5y ago
    It's quite controversial to study the IQ of different racial groups, mostly because of history (the racists of the 19th and 20th century were fascinated with racial differences) and because it can be used as a weapon by racist groups and right or wrong it feels a bit like a politically incorrect or even a racist thing to do (I'm not passing a judgment on race/IQ studies, just saying why scientists may steer away). As a jew I'm not totally comfortable with these studies btw; other than a general curiousity I don't see what they accomplish. I can even see how they give more reason to hate jews in certain circumstances, so no thanks we're quite fine already.
    - kaba0 5y ago
      Well, I think it is interesting to study it, as well as it can further our knowledge on areas that can’t really be ethically researched. Also, it can also further our medical knowledge, for example Ashkenazi Jews do have more neurological problems, which may explain their higher IQs on average. But I do agree that the results should be used sparingly (but it can’t be helped. Bad people will say what they want about a given race without any truth)
ternaryoperator 6y ago
Reminds me of the comment made by JFK in 1962 when hosting the Nobel Prize winners at the White House: " I think this is the most extraordinary collection of talent, of human knowledge, that has ever been gathered together at the White House, with the possible exception of when Thomas Jefferson dined alone."
hilbertseries 6y ago
When new fields are being researched there’s a ton of low hanging fundamental work that can be done. Over the years all of the low hanging fundamental work is done and research gets more specialized and the amount required to learn increases dramatically. I don’t think there’s any reason to think people like Gauss and von Neumann are much smarter than a modern day equivalent, say Terrence Tao. But Tao’s work, despite being across many fields, is very specialized and not as well publicized.
peter303 6y ago
MicrosSoft Research and Google Labs have thrown obscene amounts of money at luminaries. But I am not aware of major discoveries or products made by them. Probably past their prime.
kaba0 5y ago
I’ve already linked it in this comment thread, but it seems related here as well (no affiliation): https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/xPJKZyPCvap4Fven8/the-atomic-bomb-considered-as-hungarian-high-school-science https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/xPJKZyPCvap4Fven8/the-atomic...

belter 6y ago

Just reading the duties of his assistant makes you realize you should really reserve the word Genius for a few. And he certainly was one of them: "The Duties of John von Neumann’s Assistant" https://www.cantorsparadise.com/the-duties-of-john-von-neumanns-assistant-in-the-1930s-8d08e538fe2b https://www.cantorsparadise.com/the-duties-of-john-von-neuma...

ramraj07 6y ago

There have been attempts at this (new bell labs janelia farms) but I feel like the current academic system filters out the type of minds that work in such situations, and every attempt at a new bell lab recruits from the same system.

TMWNN 6y ago

>(or even specifically the Habsburgs's HRE where von Neumann was from) It is not a coincidence that the "Martians" of Budapest, of which von Neumann was one, were all Ashkenazi Jewish. Societal and genetic pressures over centuries produced unusually high IQs (and some associated genetic problems). https://web.mit.edu/fustflum/documents/papers/AshkenaziIQ.jbiosocsci.pdf https://web.mit.edu/fustflum/documents/papers/AshkenaziIQ.jb...

hospes 6y ago
Can someone please explain why this is being downvoted? That is true, “martians” were all Jewish and Ashkenazi Jews have high percentage of high IQ representatives compared to other ethnic groups.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- joelbluminator 5y ago
  It's quite controversial to study the IQ of different racial groups, mostly because of history (the racists of the 19th and 20th century were fascinated with racial differences) and because it can be used as a weapon by racist groups and right or wrong it feels a bit like a politically incorrect or even a racist thing to do (I'm not passing a judgment on race/IQ studies, just saying why scientists may steer away). As a jew I'm not totally comfortable with these studies btw; other than a general curiousity I don't see what they accomplish. I can even see how they give more reason to hate jews in certain circumstances, so no thanks we're quite fine already.
  - kaba0 5y ago
    Well, I think it is interesting to study it, as well as it can further our knowledge on areas that can’t really be ethically researched. Also, it can also further our medical knowledge, for example Ashkenazi Jews do have more neurological problems, which may explain their higher IQs on average. But I do agree that the results should be used sparingly (but it can’t be helped. Bad people will say what they want about a given race without any truth)

ternaryoperator 6y ago

Reminds me of the comment made by JFK in 1962 when hosting the Nobel Prize winners at the White House: " I think this is the most extraordinary collection of talent, of human knowledge, that has ever been gathered together at the White House, with the possible exception of when Thomas Jefferson dined alone."

hilbertseries 6y ago

When new fields are being researched there’s a ton of low hanging fundamental work that can be done. Over the years all of the low hanging fundamental work is done and research gets more specialized and the amount required to learn increases dramatically. I don’t think there’s any reason to think people like Gauss and von Neumann are much smarter than a modern day equivalent, say Terrence Tao. But Tao’s work, despite being across many fields, is very specialized and not as well publicized.

peter303 6y ago

MicrosSoft Research and Google Labs have thrown obscene amounts of money at luminaries. But I am not aware of major discoveries or products made by them. Probably past their prime.

kaba0 5y ago

I’ve already linked it in this comment thread, but it seems related here as well (no affiliation): https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/xPJKZyPCvap4Fven8/the-atomic-bomb-considered-as-hungarian-high-school-science https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/xPJKZyPCvap4Fven8/the-atomic...