6 ms·

What does the FBI offer for becoming an informant if you are a law abiding citizen?

notsureaboutpg 6y ago
They won't ruin your life. It's an offer you can't refuse.
lrvick 6y ago
They offered: "Politicians are not happy. Someone has to pay for it. If you help us we can make sure you are not that someone" And yeah, I was terrified. It was a mistake to talk to them in the first place. They got in my door by telling me they wanted my opinion on some activity they felt is a threat to a visiting president then things took a fast turn asking me about my research and contacts. FBI is 100% allowed to lie to you but if you lie back to them they own you. They also like to catch you unprepared and off guard. Don't fall for it. Say something like: "I'm sorry this is not a topic I feel well prepared to talk about right now. If you have a court order I will honor it but even then I am going to need time to collect my thoughts and ensure I am speaking accurately. I'll walk you out" Then get a lawyer to coach you on what you can and can't say. If they catch you in a lie even by accident they can -force- you to be an informant.
- viraptor 6y ago
  I'm curious, do you know what happens if you tried to make yourself useless by publicly announcing that FBI is trying to make you an informant? Has anyone tried that as a way out?
  - s5300 6y ago
    Likely obstruction of justice/some other nature of obstruction that may leave you with some pretty serious charges.
  - lrvick 6y ago
    At the time they threatened me to not tell anyone they spoke with me or unspecified bad things would happen. I am older and have spent a lot more time researching law now, and no longer choose to let strongarm chilling effects like this work. There are tons of good people in law enforcement and three letter agencies that actually protect people. I know some of them. I also know some overstep and abuse their power and it is on all of us to call it out when it happens.
- quercusa 6y ago
  Law professor James Duane reminds you: "Don't Talk to the Police" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE
  - supuun 6y ago
    thank you, i really enjoyed this lecture.
- hinkley 6y ago
  > "Politicians are not happy. Someone has to pay for it. If you help us we can make sure you are not that someone" Isn't that racketeering?
  - salawat 6y ago
    Not when the government does it. The great self-referential inconsistency, if you will.
  - __blockcipher__ 6y ago
    Wait, you mean the gang of armed thugs that extort money from people at the point of a gun, throwing them in a tiny rape cage if they disobey, and will abduct their own citizens to dose then with megadoses of psychedelics for weeks straight, while simultaneously operating a massive imperialist war machine...might be guilty of racketeering? Come to think of it, you might be on to something!
    - jimz 6y ago
      Federal agents, while technically only possessing something akin to an even less accessible version of qualified immunity under the Bivens doctrine, in reality are basically never going to be held responsible in any sort of substantive way from those they victimized on the job, unless they literally kill a bystander or something and even that isn't a sure thing.
      - nerdponx 6y ago
        That doesn't make it not racketeering...
  - throwaway0a5e 6y ago
    Regardless of what it is how many here jumping for joy if instead of a "noble security researcher" those tactics were being used against people peddling untaxed goods, rubber stamping commercial motor vehicle inspections or some other "you need to extrapolate out at least a few steps to find a victim" type crime? The government only gets away with this stuff because people turn a blind eye when its done to people they don't like.
- alfiedotwtf 6y ago
  I’ll never forget the time I kicked the door down of a brothel to see if anyone was inside while it was on fire. Police came to my house, asked me to help them in an arson investigation, I invited them in, and told them what happened... it was only when they started taking photos of my jacket I was wearing that day that I realised I was the main arson suspect. That’s when the adrenaline hit... and when it does, your brain gets muddled and so it’s damn easy to get caught out with not be accurate when recalling facts... but yeah, it’s easier not to lie when you tell them to go through a lawyer.
  - pasquinelli 6y ago
    i think i first saw this here, but it's worth repeating. https://youtu.be/d-7o9xYp7eE https://youtu.be/d-7o9xYp7eE
    - alfiedotwtf 6y ago
      hehe. It's funny because that's always in my recommended!
roget 6y ago
Not being set up.

They won't ruin your life. It's an offer you can't refuse.

They offered: "Politicians are not happy. Someone has to pay for it. If you help us we can make sure you are not that someone" And yeah, I was terrified. It was a mistake to talk to them in the first place. They got in my door by telling me they wanted my opinion on some activity they felt is a threat to a visiting president then things took a fast turn asking me about my research and contacts. FBI is 100% allowed to lie to you but if you lie back to them they own you. They also like to catch you unprepared and off guard. Don't fall for it. Say something like: "I'm sorry this is not a topic I feel well prepared to talk about right now. If you have a court order I will honor it but even then I am going to need time to collect my thoughts and ensure I am speaking accurately. I'll walk you out" Then get a lawyer to coach you on what you can and can't say. If they catch you in a lie even by accident they can -force- you to be an informant.

viraptor 6y ago
I'm curious, do you know what happens if you tried to make yourself useless by publicly announcing that FBI is trying to make you an informant? Has anyone tried that as a way out?
- s5300 6y ago
  Likely obstruction of justice/some other nature of obstruction that may leave you with some pretty serious charges.
- lrvick 6y ago
  At the time they threatened me to not tell anyone they spoke with me or unspecified bad things would happen. I am older and have spent a lot more time researching law now, and no longer choose to let strongarm chilling effects like this work. There are tons of good people in law enforcement and three letter agencies that actually protect people. I know some of them. I also know some overstep and abuse their power and it is on all of us to call it out when it happens.
quercusa 6y ago
Law professor James Duane reminds you: "Don't Talk to the Police" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE
- supuun 6y ago
  thank you, i really enjoyed this lecture.
hinkley 6y ago
> "Politicians are not happy. Someone has to pay for it. If you help us we can make sure you are not that someone" Isn't that racketeering?
- salawat 6y ago
  Not when the government does it. The great self-referential inconsistency, if you will.
- __blockcipher__ 6y ago
  Wait, you mean the gang of armed thugs that extort money from people at the point of a gun, throwing them in a tiny rape cage if they disobey, and will abduct their own citizens to dose then with megadoses of psychedelics for weeks straight, while simultaneously operating a massive imperialist war machine...might be guilty of racketeering? Come to think of it, you might be on to something!
  - jimz 6y ago
    Federal agents, while technically only possessing something akin to an even less accessible version of qualified immunity under the Bivens doctrine, in reality are basically never going to be held responsible in any sort of substantive way from those they victimized on the job, unless they literally kill a bystander or something and even that isn't a sure thing.
    - nerdponx 6y ago
      That doesn't make it not racketeering...
- throwaway0a5e 6y ago
  Regardless of what it is how many here jumping for joy if instead of a "noble security researcher" those tactics were being used against people peddling untaxed goods, rubber stamping commercial motor vehicle inspections or some other "you need to extrapolate out at least a few steps to find a victim" type crime? The government only gets away with this stuff because people turn a blind eye when its done to people they don't like.
alfiedotwtf 6y ago
I’ll never forget the time I kicked the door down of a brothel to see if anyone was inside while it was on fire. Police came to my house, asked me to help them in an arson investigation, I invited them in, and told them what happened... it was only when they started taking photos of my jacket I was wearing that day that I realised I was the main arson suspect. That’s when the adrenaline hit... and when it does, your brain gets muddled and so it’s damn easy to get caught out with not be accurate when recalling facts... but yeah, it’s easier not to lie when you tell them to go through a lawyer.
- pasquinelli 6y ago
  i think i first saw this here, but it's worth repeating. https://youtu.be/d-7o9xYp7eE https://youtu.be/d-7o9xYp7eE
  - alfiedotwtf 6y ago
    hehe. It's funny because that's always in my recommended!

roget 6y ago

Not being set up.