4 ms·

> Agreed. I AES-encrypt information that's actually private on my Dropbox. But Dropbox is providing a service grounded in simplicity. Sorry, that's the product

by sid0 15y ago

> Agreed. I AES-encrypt information that's actually private on my Dropbox. But Dropbox is providing a service grounded in simplicity. Sorry, that's the product angle. And exchanging this key without Dropbox intermediating would be much more complex than what Dropbox does now. A bit more complex, but not much more complex. See Firefox Sync's setup screen for a great execution of strong secret shared over weak password. We've known about EKE for close to 20 years. > Also, the web interface Yes, agreed. I'm not convinced it's worth it though. > sharing, public folders Yeah, these are a little more complicated. I wonder if some sort of shared secret system could work out here. > perhaps iPhone and Android apps (you have the question of how to get the key TO the device) Again, see Firefox Sync.

pavpanchekha 15y ago
Wouldn't EKE require the other computer you're syncing to to be online? I'm not a security guy, but seems like the best encryption you could do with just a password is a password-based encryption scheme, which isn't that great security-wise, not sure if the benefits are worth it. My desktop is down right now (power supply burned out, ouch) so I think I actually use the web interface more than Dropbox itself, since I only have one computer... And encryption in Javascript is a pain, since you open yourself to man-in-the-middle attacks and such. I don't know about shared secrets for sharing and such, but I haven't heard of anything even applicable beyond a few academic papers. Beyond, you know, using a different key for every file and then you can email the key to share it. But that doesn't let you revoke access from one person (I've seen papers on how to do that though) and that's also a waste of entropy. I think this is actually a nice area for research (well, maybe it's being done and I'm not aware; again, not a security guy). Personally, I don't trust closed-source systems with my encryption code, client-side or server-side or not. I'm ok with Firefox Sync, I'm sure someone would notice if it had side channel leaks, but if you want Dropbox to ask for the encryption key, how do you know what it does? Anyway, I think we're just entering the era where we understand encryption in consumer products.
- sid0 15y ago
  > Wouldn't EKE require the other computer you're syncing to to be online? It would, yes. With Firefox Sync you have two choices, either exchange keys or type in the key. I carry the key around in my wallet, so I don't think that's a big deal. > And encryption in Javascript is a pain, since you open yourself to man-in-the-middle attacks and such. SSL helps a lot here. I think uTorrent 3's remote web-accessible UI stuff does something like this, actually. edit: yeah, it generates a key on the client so the server never has access and uses SRP [1] to authenticate and exchange the key [2]. [1] https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Secure_Remote_Password_protocol https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Secure_Remote... [2] http://www.utorrent.com/legal/web-beta-privacy http://www.utorrent.com/legal/web-beta-privacy

by sid0 15y ago

pavpanchekha 15y ago

Wouldn't EKE require the other computer you're syncing to to be online? I'm not a security guy, but seems like the best encryption you could do with just a password is a password-based encryption scheme, which isn't that great security-wise, not sure if the benefits are worth it. My desktop is down right now (power supply burned out, ouch) so I think I actually use the web interface more than Dropbox itself, since I only have one computer... And encryption in Javascript is a pain, since you open yourself to man-in-the-middle attacks and such. I don't know about shared secrets for sharing and such, but I haven't heard of anything even applicable beyond a few academic papers. Beyond, you know, using a different key for every file and then you can email the key to share it. But that doesn't let you revoke access from one person (I've seen papers on how to do that though) and that's also a waste of entropy. I think this is actually a nice area for research (well, maybe it's being done and I'm not aware; again, not a security guy). Personally, I don't trust closed-source systems with my encryption code, client-side or server-side or not. I'm ok with Firefox Sync, I'm sure someone would notice if it had side channel leaks, but if you want Dropbox to ask for the encryption key, how do you know what it does? Anyway, I think we're just entering the era where we understand encryption in consumer products.

sid0 15y ago
> Wouldn't EKE require the other computer you're syncing to to be online? It would, yes. With Firefox Sync you have two choices, either exchange keys or type in the key. I carry the key around in my wallet, so I don't think that's a big deal. > And encryption in Javascript is a pain, since you open yourself to man-in-the-middle attacks and such. SSL helps a lot here. I think uTorrent 3's remote web-accessible UI stuff does something like this, actually. edit: yeah, it generates a key on the client so the server never has access and uses SRP [1] to authenticate and exchange the key [2]. [1] https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Secure_Remote_Password_protocol https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Secure_Remote... [2] http://www.utorrent.com/legal/web-beta-privacy http://www.utorrent.com/legal/web-beta-privacy