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You're buying into propaganda about British unions, blaming them for the car industry is ridiculous, and when it comes to mining you seem to think that the mine

by corin_ 6y ago

You're buying into propaganda about British unions, blaming them for the car industry is ridiculous, and when it comes to mining you seem to think that the mines would have lasted longer had unions not been against shutting mines?

goatinaboat 6y ago
you seem to think that the mines would have lasted longer had unions not been against shutting mines? At the time, the average ton of coal was costing double to extract than it was worth. Closing the loss making mines was inevitable but the viable mines could have remained open, and would have as there was still the demand for coal. The Germans do this right, their unions want their workers to have fair share of the rewards and understand that the company must be profitable in the first place for that to happen. British union leaders simply play workers against management for their own gain, then leave both workers and management worse off, but workers get the worst of it.
- corin_ 6y ago
  > "British union leaders simply play workers against management for their own gain, then leave both workers and management worse off, but workers get the worst of it." Again, you're buying into nonsense anti-union propaganda.
  - goatinaboat 6y ago
    Again, you're buying into nonsense anti-union propaganda. I'm not buying into anything. I see Germany with strong unions and a strong industrial sector and I want that here. Just there is something in the British union movement that makes it destructive instead.
    - corin_ 6y ago
      The point I'm making is that you're wrong to think that the "British union movement [.. is] destructive", in actual fact the unions have been unfairly scapegoated and villainised for decades leading some people to believe what you believe. Of course, maybe you're not buying into the propaganda but actually purposefully spreading it. Or maybe my opinions are wrong, but I obviously don't believe that to be the case. I'm afraid I can't be much more useful in my argument, I've met and discussed with many British trade union leaders and representatives, as well as many managers who didn't enjoy having to deal with unions and I have a very strong opinion that you're wrong without really having a thought about how to change your mind other than suggesting learning more about the subject. If you'd be interested I'd be happy to text a friend and ask if they have a recommendation for a single book to read about it, or maybe your mind is already made up.

by corin_ 6y ago

goatinaboat 6y ago

you seem to think that the mines would have lasted longer had unions not been against shutting mines? At the time, the average ton of coal was costing double to extract than it was worth. Closing the loss making mines was inevitable but the viable mines could have remained open, and would have as there was still the demand for coal. The Germans do this right, their unions want their workers to have fair share of the rewards and understand that the company must be profitable in the first place for that to happen. British union leaders simply play workers against management for their own gain, then leave both workers and management worse off, but workers get the worst of it.

corin_ 6y ago
> "British union leaders simply play workers against management for their own gain, then leave both workers and management worse off, but workers get the worst of it." Again, you're buying into nonsense anti-union propaganda.
- goatinaboat 6y ago
  Again, you're buying into nonsense anti-union propaganda. I'm not buying into anything. I see Germany with strong unions and a strong industrial sector and I want that here. Just there is something in the British union movement that makes it destructive instead.
  - corin_ 6y ago
    The point I'm making is that you're wrong to think that the "British union movement [.. is] destructive", in actual fact the unions have been unfairly scapegoated and villainised for decades leading some people to believe what you believe. Of course, maybe you're not buying into the propaganda but actually purposefully spreading it. Or maybe my opinions are wrong, but I obviously don't believe that to be the case. I'm afraid I can't be much more useful in my argument, I've met and discussed with many British trade union leaders and representatives, as well as many managers who didn't enjoy having to deal with unions and I have a very strong opinion that you're wrong without really having a thought about how to change your mind other than suggesting learning more about the subject. If you'd be interested I'd be happy to text a friend and ask if they have a recommendation for a single book to read about it, or maybe your mind is already made up.